Thursday, November 27, 2008
thithe
2007Christianity And The TitheDanny McDowellHONESTYThere needs to be a little HONESTY regarding this matter. Pastors often BOAST of their deep convictions, and devout entrenchment regarding “THE WORD OF GOD”. They frequently hold open invitation to those in agreement with them. They BELLOW of a “CHRIST CENTERED, BIBLE BELIEVING ADJENDA”.With pride, [bordering arrogance] they proclaim their personal conviction. They wear their “RELIGION” blazingly on their sleeve. “Yes sir there brother; I believe that the Bible is the inspired WORD OF GOD”. They will speak of “abundant grace”, and of “salvation by faith”. They will boast of the many blessings of the Father. They decorate their automobiles with the “ADVERTISING” of their conviction. They are --------------“CHURCHITES” !SACRED COWSThere is an abundance of SACRED COWS amongst the Churchites. They will vehemently deny that they have any such IDOLS. They are schmoozy in their denial, until one OPENS THE WORD, and proves them to be in grave error. They will SPIN a desperate rationalle for that which is abominable to the Christian Faith.YOU can literally see this in action. Just ask them how many days and nights Jesus was in the tomb. Jesus said; “as Jonas was in the belly of the great fish for three days, and three nights; so the Son of Man will be in the earth for THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS”. Watch the desperation in their eyes as they attempt to defy mathematical reason.See how this SACRED COW is corralled, and guarded by the Churchites. See how he dismisses the IMPORTANCE of the TRUTH in this matter. Watch the SWEAT bead upon his skin when he is threatened by the truth----------only to turn and label you as a “trouble maker”, and a sower of DISCORD”. Watch, as the graciousness of a timid spirit turns to VENOM---------and WHY ?--------because you have slain a SACRED COW !TOUCH NOT MY CASH COW--------AND DO MY PROFITS NO HARMMONEY----------is the DRIVING FORCE in the American Church. It begins at the PARKING LOT. The yearly budget for maintaining the “Church” parking lot can easily exceed the yearly income of SEVERAL families in a third world nation. Why don’t they save some cash by applying a GRAVEL [rather than the expensive blacktop surface that has to be maintained, and cleared of snow and ice in the winter] ? The yearly cost of maintaining a PARKING SPACE for the churchite’s 40,000 dollar gas guzzling S.U.V !The building, and maintenance expence of the mega-church parking lot ALONE would build a medical clinic I Calcutta, or drill FIFTY fresh water wells in South America, or fund an AIDS ORPHANAGE in Africa. BUT NOOOO----- We simply MUST have a blacktop surface, with clearly defined parking spaces for the THOUSANDS that visit our “church” on Sun-day morning. Literally TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS go into your car’s personal comfort, while millions of your “brethren” worship the Lord on a DIRT FLOOR in China, or Africa.There are even “ATTENDANTS’ who watch over the parking process. Everything goes like clockwork in the parking lot, so that the SERVICE can begin in a timely fashion. It reminds me of what I use to se back in Kansas where I grew up-------I mean; the way they use to load CATTLE from the stockyard pins, onto the rail cars for shipment.Timely and organized with a little JOLT here and there for sake of expedience. All that’s missing is a CATTLE PROD. There is a THIRTY MINUTE interval between services in which to TRADE CATTLE [cars]------and the WRANGLERS [attendants] are never late---------HUNDREDS IN-----HUNDREDS OUT-------HUNDREDS IN AGAIN, and when it’s all said and done; it boils down to the most EFFICIENT WAY to gather-----MONEY---------AND WE HAVE NOT YET CROSSED THE THREASHOLD OD THE DOORWAY.!!Now we move to the Church FOYER. “MAGNIFICENT” is the only way to describe the ENTRY-WAY to the mega-church in America. The WHITE HOUSE has no greater entry than the American Mega Church. This grand introduction to what is ahead, also serves as a POLITICAL PROPAGANDA CENTER at election time.Tables are set up, and political brochures, and HIT LISTS cover their surfaces. At this time of the year; sermons are centered in YOUR OBLIGATION AS A CHRISTIAN to vote for this candidate, or that. “Hell awaits you” if you make the wrong choice-----or at least a shunning, and dismissal from the service ledger of available candidates. You will be treated politely, but you will know with certainty, that NOW you are an OUTSIDERif you support THE OTHR GUY !. This ENTRO-WAY alone, costs THOUSANDS to function, in light of the costs of PRINTING materials, maintenance, and up-keep. Thousands, that could buy SHOES for those brethren who WALK TO “CHURCH” !You enter the GRAND ARENA [sanctuary], and GRAND IT IS! A salaried organist is playing “inspirational pieces”-------[some composed in the middle ages] -----that you do not even recognize. The organist salary pales in comparison to the cost of the instrument itself. Every note, from every PIPE, bellows out DOLLAR SIGNS1 Of course, not all “churches” are this magnificent, but you can rest assured that the less GRAND of the assemblies, would very much like to exchange places with their opulent siblings. ..Choirs of dozens of professional voices begin to sing, as the service officially begins. A salaried MINISTER OF MUSIC leads the orchestra [including harp, and strings], to elevate the spirit to a place that one believes; this must truly be--------HOLY GROUND!After the MONEY PUMP has been sufficiently PRIMED-------the pastor steps forth sporting an eight hundred dollar suit, and without a wrinkle-----because the “seating compliment” in his LEXUS is designed to be STATIC FREE----and GARMENT FRIENDLY! He begins with his necessary announcements, the collecting of the TITHE, yada, yada.The ceilings of this TEMPLE TO THE GODDESS OF TREASURE, are FIFTY FEET HIGH. The whole thing is designed to artificially induce a feeling of awe in preparation for the message, and to GOBBLE UP THE TITHE in heating, and air-conditioning expenses, in as short a time as possible.This monster [church] was intentionally designed to be--------A MONSTER-------A MONEY EATING MONSTER, with an endless and veracious appetite. It’s like one of those Star Trek creatures that feed on energy, and the more you try to kill it with your plasma-gun, the more it grows and devours everything with energy, or in this case------MONEY..What’s my point?--------My point is: ALL THIS STUFF COSTS MILLIONS !! Where do you think these MILLIONS are going to come from? Do you think that this FINANCIAL MONSTROCITY is going to support itself on the “FREEWILL” offerings of the weekly attendees?-----------ROFLOL----------IT’S THE TITHE STUPID!!In gathering the weekly TITHE, it is possible to “financially STRATIGIZE for the FUTURE”. It’s something the “church” authority can COUNT ON. Out of this dependable, and bottomless source of revenue; come plans to GROW THE CHURCH FURTHER-------ADD MORE SERVICES---------ADD TO THE MEMBERSHIP----------[trumpet fanfare please]-------AND COLLECT MORE TITHE. Something seems familiar about this. I think the world calls this a PYRAMID SCHEME, or something like that.WHAT THE NEW TESTAMENT SAYS OF THE TITHE.“TITHING” IS NOT A NEW TESTAMENT PRINCIPLE! Tithing is an element of the LAW of the Levitical system. Under the Law; the Levites [pastors] collected the TITHE from all the citizens of Israel [whether righteous or not]. This system would be best portrayed as if the AMERICAN CLERGY collected a TAX from EVERY FAMILY IN THE NATION, for the express purpose of supporting a NATIONAL RELIGION.With the gathering of the Tithe, the priesthood was able to support them selves to that degree that was established in the Law. It was God’s will that tight parameters be placed on the Levites so that their POWER to collect treasure could not easily be abused by greedy clergy. The Levites were forbidden to own property. They were forbidden to own livestock, or ANYTHING that could lead to REVENUE PRODUCTION. No INVESTMENT PORTFOLIO! No CAPITAL GAIN! NADA!!!They were compelled to be cared for BY THE PEOPLE and UNDER THE LAW. Imagine a TITHE COLLECTING PASTOR of today, living under those circumstances.. In fact, that might be the solution to many of our problems. If a pastor was to be restricted to this kind of austerity----------the pulpits would be emptied at the first sign of a problem on payday. They would “HEAR THE VOICE OF GOD” saying “COME OUT FROM AMONG THEM, AND GET THEE ANOTHER JOB----- IF YOU CAN”. A giant SUCKING SOUND would be heard, as the “pastors” exit the BACK DOORS in droves.The New Testament is CLEAR about this matter of “giving”. It is a matter of THE HEART. Paul tells us time and again, that we are to give as the Lord [through the Holy Spirit], leads us. Time and again PASTORS smother us with promises of PROSPERITY, and more importantly------GOD’S FAVOR in the tithe.God will FIX ANYTHING in your life, IF YOU FAITHFULLY TITHE!! This is what we are told. The Body, and Blood of Jesus have become irrelevant to our privilege in the work of Christ. There is ANOTHER path to God’s favor [they say]--------it’s called THE TITHE. With it; the sacrifice of the cross becomes SECOND FIDDLE. Our redemption is “INCOMPLETE” without THE TITHE!!We are INDEED REDEEMED to that point where our FINANCIAL NEED comes into play--------then our Great Redeemer becomes weak, and inadequate to save. Who will save us from our financial despair?------------“THE LAW”---------“THE LAW WILL SAVE US” in the inadequacy of Christ’s Blood. If you will only TITHE----------then “blessings” are just beyond the next bend in the road. Your salvation is COMPLETED when you add the TITHE to your faith. YEAH----THAT’S THE TICKET!! Faith carries us just so far-------but the LAW catapults us to the FINISH LINE!! Such a deal??---------NONSENSE!!!But the pastor has taken us to the Seventh Chapter of Hebrews, and proven conclusively that Abraham TITHED to Melchezedek, and Abraham lived PRIOR TO the law, and Melchedzedek was a type, and foreshadow of Christ. Doesn’t this place God’s seal of approval to this matter? Well, let’s see what the message of Hebrew’s Seven is all about.Hebrews 77:1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.7 And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.10 For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:21(For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec:)22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.KJVTo begin with; we are introduced to TWO characters in this illustration. They are both actual historical characters. They are both type, and foreshadow of things to come.The first character is an ancient HIGH PRIEST. He rules from a place called Salem [meaning “peace”]. Salem is located at a high location [later to be called Jerusalem]. This man’s name is Melchedzedek. He is a portrait in type of Christ our HIGH PRIEST.The second character is Abraham. He is our portrait type of MANKIND. He precedes the Law and Moses in history. Now the story begins;Abraham has just returned from a battle in which he slaughtered several local kings. He has rescued his nephew LOT, who had been captured by those kings. He also comes with all the people that had been taken with Lot, and all the BOOTY OF WAR. This Melchedzedek descends from his throne in Salem, and meets Abraham in the valley below. Abraham knows that the KING OF SALEM has come to extract a gift [tithe], and Abraham respectfully complies.Now HERE is where the whole thing brings CLARITY to this matter of the TITHE. Abraham gives TITHE of the booty of war. In exchange; the KING OF SALEM gives BREAD AND WINE to Abraham. Can you see what has happened here? Abraham gives TITHE------the representation of THE LAW; and Melchedzedek gives to ABRAHAM--------BREAD AND WINE, the very SYMBOL of the New Testament in Christ’s BODY AND BLOOD. This entire story is a portrait of the exchange made at the cross.It was the exchange of the system of LAW-------for that of GRACE. The story goes on to say; “and the LESS [Abraham] was blessed of the GREATER [the King of Salem]-- [verse 7]. Do you see in this typology, that GRACE is more excellent than LAW, and that Melchedzedek [Christ] left his home in Salem [heaven], and descended to the valley below [earth], and met with Abraham [mankind], and received the TITHE [law] unto himself, and blessed Abraham with BREAD AND WINE [the testament in Christ’s body, and blood]------and Abraham [the lesser---the law] received of Melchedzedek [the greater----the New Covenant in grace] ?? This is the message of the ENTIRE BOOK OF HEBREWS. The writer WARNS the Hebrew Church to SHUN THE LAW, for in returning to the things of the LAW, one presents himself EXEMPT from the benefits of GRACE-----and there IS NO REMEDY to those who would try to BLEND law and grace.KJVHeb 6:4-64 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shameKJVWhen CHRIST OUR PASSOVER screamed out these words: “ IT IS FINISHED”; the VEIL that separated God and man, was FOREVER destroyed. Three and one half years into Christ’s ministry-------HE CONFIRMED THE COVENANT WITH MANY, AND CAUSED THE SACRIFICE AND OBLATION FOR SIN TO CEASE !!!There is NO LONGER a path to God’s blessing, other than that TRAIL OF BLOOD that flows from the STAUROS. I beseech you as a brother in Christ, to cease, and desist from the coercion in the tithe. It is reprehensible that you should believe that the TITHE survived the cross. Christ PAID THE TITHE for the entirety of human kind.Now our offerings are made in the NEW Holy of Holies---------the heart of the elect. Our gifts, and giving are far SUPERIOR to that gift given by Abraham. Our gifts are motivated in purity, and recompensed in JOY. FORSAKE THE TITHE, and FORSAKE RELIGIOUS COERCION. Danny McDowell
Thursday, November 27, 2008
thithe
2007
Christianity And The Tithe
Danny McDowell
HONESTY
There needs to be a little HONESTY regarding this matter. Pastors often BOAST of their deep convictions, and devout entrenchment regarding “THE WORD OF GOD”. They frequently hold open invitation to those in agreement with them. They BELLOW of a “CHRIST CENTERED, BIBLE BELIEVING ADJENDA”.
With pride, [bordering arrogance] they proclaim their personal conviction. They wear their “RELIGION” blazingly on their sleeve. “Yes sir there brother; I believe that the Bible is the inspired WORD OF GOD”. They will speak of “abundant grace”, and of “salvation by faith”. They will boast of the many blessings of the Father. They decorate their automobiles with the “ADVERTISING” of their conviction. They are --------------“CHURCHITES” !
SACRED COWS
There is an abundance of SACRED COWS amongst the Churchites. They will vehemently deny that they have any such IDOLS. They are schmoozy in their denial, until one OPENS THE WORD, and proves them to be in grave error. They will SPIN a desperate rationalle for that which is abominable to the Christian Faith.
YOU can literally see this in action. Just ask them how many days and nights Jesus was in the tomb. Jesus said; “as Jonas was in the belly of the great fish for three days, and three nights; so the Son of Man will be in the earth for THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS”. Watch the desperation in their eyes as they attempt to defy mathematical reason.
See how this SACRED COW is corralled, and guarded by the Churchites. See how he dismisses the IMPORTANCE of the TRUTH in this matter. Watch the SWEAT bead upon his skin when he is threatened by the truth----------only to turn and label you as a “trouble maker”, and a sower of DISCORD”. Watch, as the graciousness of a timid spirit turns to VENOM---------and WHY ?--------because you have slain a SACRED COW !
TOUCH NOT MY CASH COW--------AND DO MY PROFITS NO HARM
MONEY----------is the DRIVING FORCE in the American Church. It begins at the PARKING LOT. The yearly budget for maintaining the “Church” parking lot can easily exceed the yearly income of SEVERAL families in a third world nation. Why don’t they save some cash by applying a GRAVEL [rather than the expensive blacktop surface that has to be maintained, and cleared of snow and ice in the winter] ? The yearly cost of maintaining a PARKING SPACE for the churchite’s 40,000 dollar gas guzzling S.U.V !
The building, and maintenance expence of the mega-church parking lot ALONE would build a medical clinic I Calcutta, or drill FIFTY fresh water wells in South America, or fund an AIDS ORPHANAGE in Africa. BUT NOOOO----- We simply MUST have a blacktop surface, with clearly defined parking spaces for the THOUSANDS that visit our “church” on Sun-day morning. Literally TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS go into your car’s personal comfort, while millions of your “brethren” worship the Lord on a DIRT FLOOR in China, or Africa.
There are even “ATTENDANTS’ who watch over the parking process. Everything goes like clockwork in the parking lot, so that the SERVICE can begin in a timely fashion. It reminds me of what I use to se back in Kansas where I grew up-------I mean; the way they use to load CATTLE from the stockyard pins, onto the rail cars for shipment.
Timely and organized with a little JOLT here and there for sake of expedience. All that’s missing is a CATTLE PROD. There is a THIRTY MINUTE interval between services in which to TRADE CATTLE [cars]------and the WRANGLERS [attendants] are never late---------HUNDREDS IN-----HUNDREDS OUT-------HUNDREDS IN AGAIN, and when it’s all said and done; it boils down to the most EFFICIENT WAY to gather-----MONEY---------AND WE HAVE NOT YET CROSSED THE THREASHOLD OD THE DOORWAY.!!
Now we move to the Church FOYER. “MAGNIFICENT” is the only way to describe the ENTRY-WAY to the mega-church in America. The WHITE HOUSE has no greater entry than the American Mega Church. This grand introduction to what is ahead, also serves as a POLITICAL PROPAGANDA CENTER at election time.
Tables are set up, and political brochures, and HIT LISTS cover their surfaces. At this time of the year; sermons are centered in YOUR OBLIGATION AS A CHRISTIAN to vote for this candidate, or that. “Hell awaits you” if you make the wrong choice-----or at least a shunning, and dismissal from the service ledger of available candidates. You will be treated politely, but you will know with certainty, that NOW you are an OUTSIDER
if you support THE OTHR GUY !. This ENTRO-WAY alone, costs THOUSANDS to function, in light of the costs of PRINTING materials, maintenance, and up-keep. Thousands, that could buy SHOES for those brethren who WALK TO “CHURCH” !
You enter the GRAND ARENA [sanctuary], and GRAND IT IS! A salaried organist is playing “inspirational pieces”-------[some composed in the middle ages] -----that you do not even recognize. The organist salary pales in comparison to the cost of the instrument itself. Every note, from every PIPE, bellows out DOLLAR SIGNS1 Of course, not all “churches” are this magnificent, but you can rest assured that the less GRAND of the assemblies, would very much like to exchange places with their opulent siblings. ..
Choirs of dozens of professional voices begin to sing, as the service officially begins. A salaried MINISTER OF MUSIC leads the orchestra [including harp, and strings], to elevate the spirit to a place that one believes; this must truly be--------HOLY GROUND!
After the MONEY PUMP has been sufficiently PRIMED-------the pastor steps forth sporting an eight hundred dollar suit, and without a wrinkle-----because the “seating compliment” in his LEXUS is designed to be STATIC FREE----and GARMENT FRIENDLY! He begins with his necessary announcements, the collecting of the TITHE, yada, yada.
The ceilings of this TEMPLE TO THE GODDESS OF TREASURE, are FIFTY FEET HIGH. The whole thing is designed to artificially induce a feeling of awe in preparation for the message, and to GOBBLE UP THE TITHE in heating, and air-conditioning expenses, in as short a time as possible.
This monster [church] was intentionally designed to be--------A MONSTER-------A MONEY EATING MONSTER, with an endless and veracious appetite. It’s like one of those Star Trek creatures that feed on energy, and the more you try to kill it with your plasma-gun, the more it grows and devours everything with energy, or in this case------MONEY..
What’s my point?--------My point is: ALL THIS STUFF COSTS MILLIONS !! Where do you think these MILLIONS are going to come from? Do you think that this FINANCIAL MONSTROCITY is going to support itself on the “FREEWILL” offerings of the weekly attendees?-----------ROFLOL----------IT’S THE TITHE STUPID!!
In gathering the weekly TITHE, it is possible to “financially STRATIGIZE for the FUTURE”. It’s something the “church” authority can COUNT ON. Out of this dependable, and bottomless source of revenue; come plans to GROW THE CHURCH FURTHER-------ADD MORE SERVICES---------ADD TO THE MEMBERSHIP----------[trumpet fanfare please]-------AND COLLECT MORE TITHE. Something seems familiar about this. I think the world calls this a PYRAMID SCHEME, or something like that.
WHAT THE NEW TESTAMENT SAYS OF THE TITHE.
“TITHING” IS NOT A NEW TESTAMENT PRINCIPLE! Tithing is an element of the LAW of the Levitical system. Under the Law; the Levites [pastors] collected the TITHE from all the citizens of Israel [whether righteous or not]. This system would be best portrayed as if the AMERICAN CLERGY collected a TAX from EVERY FAMILY IN THE NATION, for the express purpose of supporting a NATIONAL RELIGION.
With the gathering of the Tithe, the priesthood was able to support them selves to that degree that was established in the Law. It was God’s will that tight parameters be placed on the Levites so that their POWER to collect treasure could not easily be abused by greedy clergy. The Levites were forbidden to own property. They were forbidden to own livestock, or ANYTHING that could lead to REVENUE PRODUCTION. No INVESTMENT PORTFOLIO! No CAPITAL GAIN! NADA!!!
They were compelled to be cared for BY THE PEOPLE and UNDER THE LAW. Imagine a TITHE COLLECTING PASTOR of today, living under those circumstances.. In fact, that might be the solution to many of our problems. If a pastor was to be restricted to this kind of austerity----------the pulpits would be emptied at the first sign of a problem on payday. They would “HEAR THE VOICE OF GOD” saying “COME OUT FROM AMONG THEM, AND GET THEE ANOTHER JOB----- IF YOU CAN”. A giant SUCKING SOUND would be heard, as the “pastors” exit the BACK DOORS in droves.
The New Testament is CLEAR about this matter of “giving”. It is a matter of THE HEART. Paul tells us time and again, that we are to give as the Lord [through the Holy Spirit], leads us. Time and again PASTORS smother us with promises of PROSPERITY, and more importantly------GOD’S FAVOR in the tithe.
God will FIX ANYTHING in your life, IF YOU FAITHFULLY TITHE!! This is what we are told. The Body, and Blood of Jesus have become irrelevant to our privilege in the work of Christ. There is ANOTHER path to God’s favor [they say]--------it’s called THE TITHE. With it; the sacrifice of the cross becomes SECOND FIDDLE. Our redemption is “INCOMPLETE” without THE TITHE!!
We are INDEED REDEEMED to that point where our FINANCIAL NEED comes into play--------then our Great Redeemer becomes weak, and inadequate to save. Who will save us from our financial despair?------------“THE LAW”---------“THE LAW WILL SAVE US” in the inadequacy of Christ’s Blood. If you will only TITHE----------then “blessings” are just beyond the next bend in the road. Your salvation is COMPLETED when you add the TITHE to your faith. YEAH----THAT’S THE TICKET!! Faith carries us just so far-------but the LAW catapults us to the FINISH LINE!! Such a deal??---------NONSENSE!!!
But the pastor has taken us to the Seventh Chapter of Hebrews, and proven conclusively that Abraham TITHED to Melchezedek, and Abraham lived PRIOR TO the law, and Melchedzedek was a type, and foreshadow of Christ. Doesn’t this place God’s seal of approval to this matter? Well, let’s see what the message of Hebrew’s Seven is all about.
Hebrews 7
7:1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.
5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
7 And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.10 For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.
11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.
15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:
21(For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec:)
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:
24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.
25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.
26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;
27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.
28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.
KJV
To begin with; we are introduced to TWO characters in this illustration. They are both actual historical characters. They are both type, and foreshadow of things to come.
The first character is an ancient HIGH PRIEST. He rules from a place called Salem [meaning “peace”]. Salem is located at a high location [later to be called Jerusalem]. This man’s name is Melchedzedek. He is a portrait in type of Christ our HIGH PRIEST.
The second character is Abraham. He is our portrait type of MANKIND. He precedes the Law and Moses in history. Now the story begins;
Abraham has just returned from a battle in which he slaughtered several local kings. He has rescued his nephew LOT, who had been captured by those kings. He also comes with all the people that had been taken with Lot, and all the BOOTY OF WAR. This Melchedzedek descends from his throne in Salem, and meets Abraham in the valley below. Abraham knows that the KING OF SALEM has come to extract a gift [tithe], and Abraham respectfully complies.
Now HERE is where the whole thing brings CLARITY to this matter of the TITHE. Abraham gives TITHE of the booty of war. In exchange; the KING OF SALEM gives BREAD AND WINE to Abraham. Can you see what has happened here? Abraham gives TITHE------the representation of THE LAW; and Melchedzedek gives to ABRAHAM--------BREAD AND WINE, the very SYMBOL of the New Testament in Christ’s BODY AND BLOOD. This entire story is a portrait of the exchange made at the cross.
It was the exchange of the system of LAW-------for that of GRACE. The story goes on to say; “and the LESS [Abraham] was blessed of the GREATER [the King of Salem]-- [verse 7]. Do you see in this typology, that GRACE is more excellent than LAW, and that Melchedzedek [Christ] left his home in Salem [heaven], and descended to the valley below [earth], and met with Abraham [mankind], and received the TITHE [law] unto himself, and blessed Abraham with BREAD AND WINE [the testament in Christ’s body, and blood]------and Abraham [the lesser---the law] received of Melchedzedek [the greater----the New Covenant in grace] ?? This is the message of the ENTIRE BOOK OF HEBREWS. The writer WARNS the Hebrew Church to SHUN THE LAW, for in returning to the things of the LAW, one presents himself EXEMPT from the benefits of GRACE-----and there IS NO REMEDY to those who would try to BLEND law and grace.
KJV
Heb 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame
KJV
When CHRIST OUR PASSOVER screamed out these words: “ IT IS FINISHED”; the VEIL that separated God and man, was FOREVER destroyed. Three and one half years into Christ’s ministry-------HE CONFIRMED THE COVENANT WITH MANY, AND CAUSED THE SACRIFICE AND OBLATION FOR SIN TO CEASE !!!
There is NO LONGER a path to God’s blessing, other than that TRAIL OF BLOOD that flows from the STAUROS. I beseech you as a brother in Christ, to cease, and desist from the coercion in the tithe. It is reprehensible that you should believe that the TITHE survived the cross. Christ PAID THE TITHE for the entirety of human kind.
Now our offerings are made in the NEW Holy of Holies---------the heart of the elect. Our gifts, and giving are far SUPERIOR to that gift given by Abraham. Our gifts are motivated in purity, and recompensed in JOY. FORSAKE THE TITHE, and FORSAKE RELIGIOUS COERCION. Danny McDowell
Christianity And The Tithe
Danny McDowell
HONESTY
There needs to be a little HONESTY regarding this matter. Pastors often BOAST of their deep convictions, and devout entrenchment regarding “THE WORD OF GOD”. They frequently hold open invitation to those in agreement with them. They BELLOW of a “CHRIST CENTERED, BIBLE BELIEVING ADJENDA”.
With pride, [bordering arrogance] they proclaim their personal conviction. They wear their “RELIGION” blazingly on their sleeve. “Yes sir there brother; I believe that the Bible is the inspired WORD OF GOD”. They will speak of “abundant grace”, and of “salvation by faith”. They will boast of the many blessings of the Father. They decorate their automobiles with the “ADVERTISING” of their conviction. They are --------------“CHURCHITES” !
SACRED COWS
There is an abundance of SACRED COWS amongst the Churchites. They will vehemently deny that they have any such IDOLS. They are schmoozy in their denial, until one OPENS THE WORD, and proves them to be in grave error. They will SPIN a desperate rationalle for that which is abominable to the Christian Faith.
YOU can literally see this in action. Just ask them how many days and nights Jesus was in the tomb. Jesus said; “as Jonas was in the belly of the great fish for three days, and three nights; so the Son of Man will be in the earth for THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS”. Watch the desperation in their eyes as they attempt to defy mathematical reason.
See how this SACRED COW is corralled, and guarded by the Churchites. See how he dismisses the IMPORTANCE of the TRUTH in this matter. Watch the SWEAT bead upon his skin when he is threatened by the truth----------only to turn and label you as a “trouble maker”, and a sower of DISCORD”. Watch, as the graciousness of a timid spirit turns to VENOM---------and WHY ?--------because you have slain a SACRED COW !
TOUCH NOT MY CASH COW--------AND DO MY PROFITS NO HARM
MONEY----------is the DRIVING FORCE in the American Church. It begins at the PARKING LOT. The yearly budget for maintaining the “Church” parking lot can easily exceed the yearly income of SEVERAL families in a third world nation. Why don’t they save some cash by applying a GRAVEL [rather than the expensive blacktop surface that has to be maintained, and cleared of snow and ice in the winter] ? The yearly cost of maintaining a PARKING SPACE for the churchite’s 40,000 dollar gas guzzling S.U.V !
The building, and maintenance expence of the mega-church parking lot ALONE would build a medical clinic I Calcutta, or drill FIFTY fresh water wells in South America, or fund an AIDS ORPHANAGE in Africa. BUT NOOOO----- We simply MUST have a blacktop surface, with clearly defined parking spaces for the THOUSANDS that visit our “church” on Sun-day morning. Literally TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS go into your car’s personal comfort, while millions of your “brethren” worship the Lord on a DIRT FLOOR in China, or Africa.
There are even “ATTENDANTS’ who watch over the parking process. Everything goes like clockwork in the parking lot, so that the SERVICE can begin in a timely fashion. It reminds me of what I use to se back in Kansas where I grew up-------I mean; the way they use to load CATTLE from the stockyard pins, onto the rail cars for shipment.
Timely and organized with a little JOLT here and there for sake of expedience. All that’s missing is a CATTLE PROD. There is a THIRTY MINUTE interval between services in which to TRADE CATTLE [cars]------and the WRANGLERS [attendants] are never late---------HUNDREDS IN-----HUNDREDS OUT-------HUNDREDS IN AGAIN, and when it’s all said and done; it boils down to the most EFFICIENT WAY to gather-----MONEY---------AND WE HAVE NOT YET CROSSED THE THREASHOLD OD THE DOORWAY.!!
Now we move to the Church FOYER. “MAGNIFICENT” is the only way to describe the ENTRY-WAY to the mega-church in America. The WHITE HOUSE has no greater entry than the American Mega Church. This grand introduction to what is ahead, also serves as a POLITICAL PROPAGANDA CENTER at election time.
Tables are set up, and political brochures, and HIT LISTS cover their surfaces. At this time of the year; sermons are centered in YOUR OBLIGATION AS A CHRISTIAN to vote for this candidate, or that. “Hell awaits you” if you make the wrong choice-----or at least a shunning, and dismissal from the service ledger of available candidates. You will be treated politely, but you will know with certainty, that NOW you are an OUTSIDER
if you support THE OTHR GUY !. This ENTRO-WAY alone, costs THOUSANDS to function, in light of the costs of PRINTING materials, maintenance, and up-keep. Thousands, that could buy SHOES for those brethren who WALK TO “CHURCH” !
You enter the GRAND ARENA [sanctuary], and GRAND IT IS! A salaried organist is playing “inspirational pieces”-------[some composed in the middle ages] -----that you do not even recognize. The organist salary pales in comparison to the cost of the instrument itself. Every note, from every PIPE, bellows out DOLLAR SIGNS1 Of course, not all “churches” are this magnificent, but you can rest assured that the less GRAND of the assemblies, would very much like to exchange places with their opulent siblings. ..
Choirs of dozens of professional voices begin to sing, as the service officially begins. A salaried MINISTER OF MUSIC leads the orchestra [including harp, and strings], to elevate the spirit to a place that one believes; this must truly be--------HOLY GROUND!
After the MONEY PUMP has been sufficiently PRIMED-------the pastor steps forth sporting an eight hundred dollar suit, and without a wrinkle-----because the “seating compliment” in his LEXUS is designed to be STATIC FREE----and GARMENT FRIENDLY! He begins with his necessary announcements, the collecting of the TITHE, yada, yada.
The ceilings of this TEMPLE TO THE GODDESS OF TREASURE, are FIFTY FEET HIGH. The whole thing is designed to artificially induce a feeling of awe in preparation for the message, and to GOBBLE UP THE TITHE in heating, and air-conditioning expenses, in as short a time as possible.
This monster [church] was intentionally designed to be--------A MONSTER-------A MONEY EATING MONSTER, with an endless and veracious appetite. It’s like one of those Star Trek creatures that feed on energy, and the more you try to kill it with your plasma-gun, the more it grows and devours everything with energy, or in this case------MONEY..
What’s my point?--------My point is: ALL THIS STUFF COSTS MILLIONS !! Where do you think these MILLIONS are going to come from? Do you think that this FINANCIAL MONSTROCITY is going to support itself on the “FREEWILL” offerings of the weekly attendees?-----------ROFLOL----------IT’S THE TITHE STUPID!!
In gathering the weekly TITHE, it is possible to “financially STRATIGIZE for the FUTURE”. It’s something the “church” authority can COUNT ON. Out of this dependable, and bottomless source of revenue; come plans to GROW THE CHURCH FURTHER-------ADD MORE SERVICES---------ADD TO THE MEMBERSHIP----------[trumpet fanfare please]-------AND COLLECT MORE TITHE. Something seems familiar about this. I think the world calls this a PYRAMID SCHEME, or something like that.
WHAT THE NEW TESTAMENT SAYS OF THE TITHE.
“TITHING” IS NOT A NEW TESTAMENT PRINCIPLE! Tithing is an element of the LAW of the Levitical system. Under the Law; the Levites [pastors] collected the TITHE from all the citizens of Israel [whether righteous or not]. This system would be best portrayed as if the AMERICAN CLERGY collected a TAX from EVERY FAMILY IN THE NATION, for the express purpose of supporting a NATIONAL RELIGION.
With the gathering of the Tithe, the priesthood was able to support them selves to that degree that was established in the Law. It was God’s will that tight parameters be placed on the Levites so that their POWER to collect treasure could not easily be abused by greedy clergy. The Levites were forbidden to own property. They were forbidden to own livestock, or ANYTHING that could lead to REVENUE PRODUCTION. No INVESTMENT PORTFOLIO! No CAPITAL GAIN! NADA!!!
They were compelled to be cared for BY THE PEOPLE and UNDER THE LAW. Imagine a TITHE COLLECTING PASTOR of today, living under those circumstances.. In fact, that might be the solution to many of our problems. If a pastor was to be restricted to this kind of austerity----------the pulpits would be emptied at the first sign of a problem on payday. They would “HEAR THE VOICE OF GOD” saying “COME OUT FROM AMONG THEM, AND GET THEE ANOTHER JOB----- IF YOU CAN”. A giant SUCKING SOUND would be heard, as the “pastors” exit the BACK DOORS in droves.
The New Testament is CLEAR about this matter of “giving”. It is a matter of THE HEART. Paul tells us time and again, that we are to give as the Lord [through the Holy Spirit], leads us. Time and again PASTORS smother us with promises of PROSPERITY, and more importantly------GOD’S FAVOR in the tithe.
God will FIX ANYTHING in your life, IF YOU FAITHFULLY TITHE!! This is what we are told. The Body, and Blood of Jesus have become irrelevant to our privilege in the work of Christ. There is ANOTHER path to God’s favor [they say]--------it’s called THE TITHE. With it; the sacrifice of the cross becomes SECOND FIDDLE. Our redemption is “INCOMPLETE” without THE TITHE!!
We are INDEED REDEEMED to that point where our FINANCIAL NEED comes into play--------then our Great Redeemer becomes weak, and inadequate to save. Who will save us from our financial despair?------------“THE LAW”---------“THE LAW WILL SAVE US” in the inadequacy of Christ’s Blood. If you will only TITHE----------then “blessings” are just beyond the next bend in the road. Your salvation is COMPLETED when you add the TITHE to your faith. YEAH----THAT’S THE TICKET!! Faith carries us just so far-------but the LAW catapults us to the FINISH LINE!! Such a deal??---------NONSENSE!!!
But the pastor has taken us to the Seventh Chapter of Hebrews, and proven conclusively that Abraham TITHED to Melchezedek, and Abraham lived PRIOR TO the law, and Melchedzedek was a type, and foreshadow of Christ. Doesn’t this place God’s seal of approval to this matter? Well, let’s see what the message of Hebrew’s Seven is all about.
Hebrews 7
7:1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.
5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
7 And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.10 For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.
11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.
15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:
21(For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec:)
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:
24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.
25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.
26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;
27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.
28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.
KJV
To begin with; we are introduced to TWO characters in this illustration. They are both actual historical characters. They are both type, and foreshadow of things to come.
The first character is an ancient HIGH PRIEST. He rules from a place called Salem [meaning “peace”]. Salem is located at a high location [later to be called Jerusalem]. This man’s name is Melchedzedek. He is a portrait in type of Christ our HIGH PRIEST.
The second character is Abraham. He is our portrait type of MANKIND. He precedes the Law and Moses in history. Now the story begins;
Abraham has just returned from a battle in which he slaughtered several local kings. He has rescued his nephew LOT, who had been captured by those kings. He also comes with all the people that had been taken with Lot, and all the BOOTY OF WAR. This Melchedzedek descends from his throne in Salem, and meets Abraham in the valley below. Abraham knows that the KING OF SALEM has come to extract a gift [tithe], and Abraham respectfully complies.
Now HERE is where the whole thing brings CLARITY to this matter of the TITHE. Abraham gives TITHE of the booty of war. In exchange; the KING OF SALEM gives BREAD AND WINE to Abraham. Can you see what has happened here? Abraham gives TITHE------the representation of THE LAW; and Melchedzedek gives to ABRAHAM--------BREAD AND WINE, the very SYMBOL of the New Testament in Christ’s BODY AND BLOOD. This entire story is a portrait of the exchange made at the cross.
It was the exchange of the system of LAW-------for that of GRACE. The story goes on to say; “and the LESS [Abraham] was blessed of the GREATER [the King of Salem]-- [verse 7]. Do you see in this typology, that GRACE is more excellent than LAW, and that Melchedzedek [Christ] left his home in Salem [heaven], and descended to the valley below [earth], and met with Abraham [mankind], and received the TITHE [law] unto himself, and blessed Abraham with BREAD AND WINE [the testament in Christ’s body, and blood]------and Abraham [the lesser---the law] received of Melchedzedek [the greater----the New Covenant in grace] ?? This is the message of the ENTIRE BOOK OF HEBREWS. The writer WARNS the Hebrew Church to SHUN THE LAW, for in returning to the things of the LAW, one presents himself EXEMPT from the benefits of GRACE-----and there IS NO REMEDY to those who would try to BLEND law and grace.
KJV
Heb 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame
KJV
When CHRIST OUR PASSOVER screamed out these words: “ IT IS FINISHED”; the VEIL that separated God and man, was FOREVER destroyed. Three and one half years into Christ’s ministry-------HE CONFIRMED THE COVENANT WITH MANY, AND CAUSED THE SACRIFICE AND OBLATION FOR SIN TO CEASE !!!
There is NO LONGER a path to God’s blessing, other than that TRAIL OF BLOOD that flows from the STAUROS. I beseech you as a brother in Christ, to cease, and desist from the coercion in the tithe. It is reprehensible that you should believe that the TITHE survived the cross. Christ PAID THE TITHE for the entirety of human kind.
Now our offerings are made in the NEW Holy of Holies---------the heart of the elect. Our gifts, and giving are far SUPERIOR to that gift given by Abraham. Our gifts are motivated in purity, and recompensed in JOY. FORSAKE THE TITHE, and FORSAKE RELIGIOUS COERCION. Danny McDowell
INTRODUCTION
30, 2008
An Introduction
Danny McDowellMy name is Dan McDowell. I have been interested in Bible prophecy since I was a young believer almost 30 years ago when I read "The Late Great Planet Earth" by Hal Lindsay. I was fascinated and hooked on the subject. I read everything I could get my hands on. Then I made a terrible mistake.I began to reference the books I read against another book - The Bible. I became frustrated so I developed a method of tolerance to enable myself to continue to feed my appetite for Bible Prophecy. I developed a "Danger List" of verses in the Bible that had caused me to become confused. My list began with Matthew 24 and Mark 13. Next on the list was II Thessalonians 2. Then came "THE BOOK OF REVELATION." I could hear deafening alarms go off in my head and the voice as a Trumpet shouting "STAY AWAY FROM THE BOOK & NOW!" So I got out quick and went back to safer ground.* Hal Lindsay* Dave Hunt* Grant Jefferies* Jack Van Impe* And OthersThings were more peaceful there. It all seemed to make sense as long as I avoided that "Other Book." From time to time I seemed to be drawn to the "Other Book" so I would muster the strength to GO IN. After a short time in "THE BOOK," I scrambled out of there looking, and feeling like I had tangled with a pack of rabid junk yard dogs and would lick my wounds and return to the safety of Hal Lindsay, for he only was worthy.I developed another mechanism for living with my fascination with Prophecy. I called it the "I'm too stupid to research this stuff for myself" mechanism. I could leave this stuff for those who truly understand. This was quite comfortable indeed and yet TEMPTATION was always at hand. The Book, THE BOOK, it was always THE BOOK, black and foreboding. Confusion and frustration was therein. Problems, problems for more than 25 years. Then came Marvin. Marvin Rosenthal and "The Pre-Wrath Rapture" and Gene Bacon "Rapture, Truth or Consequences" and others."Halleluiah," I can open THE BOOK now, no sirens or whistles, no trumpet voices, "and he shall send his angels to gather his elect from Heaven and Earth." "That's it", "That's it", It's in the Book. It's all there. I turned the table. Now I began to use THE BOOK as the authority and to weigh Hal and his friends against THE BOOK - THE BIBLE - THE WORD OF GOD - THE LOGOS and pieces came into place as the key pieces were discovered in THE BIBLE.This began a 2-year study that has been profound, enlightening and exciting at times (especially in light of events happening in the world today). I purchased air time at a local AM radio station and began to proclaim the Word of prophecy. The book of Revelation became a joy and a road map into the future. I spent many hours pouring over that most foreboding work - The Old Testament.Everything Fits..when you use the scripture to define Truth. Matthew 24 and Mark 13 is the "hub" of bible prophecy. The words of Jesus are the key to unlocking the future. It all works now. Now I can open "THE BOOK." I hope you will do the same.Revelation 20:5BTHIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTIONWARNINGIf you are weak kneed and Mamby Pamby about identifying false doctrine, paganism, and apostasy in evangelical Christianity, then THIS SITE IS NOT FOR YOU! Look to others who are willing to dance around the truth. I'm tired of dancing!Buckle up. Here we go!
P
An Introduction
Danny McDowellMy name is Dan McDowell. I have been interested in Bible prophecy since I was a young believer almost 30 years ago when I read "The Late Great Planet Earth" by Hal Lindsay. I was fascinated and hooked on the subject. I read everything I could get my hands on. Then I made a terrible mistake.I began to reference the books I read against another book - The Bible. I became frustrated so I developed a method of tolerance to enable myself to continue to feed my appetite for Bible Prophecy. I developed a "Danger List" of verses in the Bible that had caused me to become confused. My list began with Matthew 24 and Mark 13. Next on the list was II Thessalonians 2. Then came "THE BOOK OF REVELATION." I could hear deafening alarms go off in my head and the voice as a Trumpet shouting "STAY AWAY FROM THE BOOK & NOW!" So I got out quick and went back to safer ground.* Hal Lindsay* Dave Hunt* Grant Jefferies* Jack Van Impe* And OthersThings were more peaceful there. It all seemed to make sense as long as I avoided that "Other Book." From time to time I seemed to be drawn to the "Other Book" so I would muster the strength to GO IN. After a short time in "THE BOOK," I scrambled out of there looking, and feeling like I had tangled with a pack of rabid junk yard dogs and would lick my wounds and return to the safety of Hal Lindsay, for he only was worthy.I developed another mechanism for living with my fascination with Prophecy. I called it the "I'm too stupid to research this stuff for myself" mechanism. I could leave this stuff for those who truly understand. This was quite comfortable indeed and yet TEMPTATION was always at hand. The Book, THE BOOK, it was always THE BOOK, black and foreboding. Confusion and frustration was therein. Problems, problems for more than 25 years. Then came Marvin. Marvin Rosenthal and "The Pre-Wrath Rapture" and Gene Bacon "Rapture, Truth or Consequences" and others."Halleluiah," I can open THE BOOK now, no sirens or whistles, no trumpet voices, "and he shall send his angels to gather his elect from Heaven and Earth." "That's it", "That's it", It's in the Book. It's all there. I turned the table. Now I began to use THE BOOK as the authority and to weigh Hal and his friends against THE BOOK - THE BIBLE - THE WORD OF GOD - THE LOGOS and pieces came into place as the key pieces were discovered in THE BIBLE.This began a 2-year study that has been profound, enlightening and exciting at times (especially in light of events happening in the world today). I purchased air time at a local AM radio station and began to proclaim the Word of prophecy. The book of Revelation became a joy and a road map into the future. I spent many hours pouring over that most foreboding work - The Old Testament.Everything Fits..when you use the scripture to define Truth. Matthew 24 and Mark 13 is the "hub" of bible prophecy. The words of Jesus are the key to unlocking the future. It all works now. Now I can open "THE BOOK." I hope you will do the same.Revelation 20:5BTHIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTIONWARNINGIf you are weak kneed and Mamby Pamby about identifying false doctrine, paganism, and apostasy in evangelical Christianity, then THIS SITE IS NOT FOR YOU! Look to others who are willing to dance around the truth. I'm tired of dancing!Buckle up. Here we go!
P
The SEVENTY WEEKS OF DANIEL
24, 2007
The 70 Weeks of Daniel
"The 70 Weeks of Daniel"Contiguous / Unbroken“THOUGH THIS PRESENTATION DOES NOT REFLECT MY OWN VIEW, THAT THE REMAINING HALF OF THE SEVENTIETH WEEK IS A FUTURE EVENT: THIS ARTICLE CERTAINLY REPRESENTS A FAITHFUL INTERPRETATION OF DANIEL 9:26-27 AS FAR AS THAT POINT DESCRIBED AS----“THE MIDST OF THE WEEK”. AS I HAVE SAID-------I BELIEVE THAT THE REMAINING 3 ½ YEARS. [the GREAT TRIBULATION] IS A FUTURE EVENT !” I DO NOT KNOW THE AUTHOR. Danny McDowellDetermining the Starting Point for the Seventy Weeks Prophecy10a. There are four historic events to choose from;Upon the conquering of Babylon by Cyrus, King of Persia and the Medes/Persian Empire, He made a decree that God had revealed to Him that Israel should be set free of their captivity, and Cyrus decreed that whosoever would, should go up to Jerusalem and rebuild the temple to the one God YHVH.This God inspired act set off a series of four events in History by several Kings of the Medes/Persian Empire. Here are four candidate, Start-Up dates to choose from for the beginning of the "Seventy Weeks" prophecy.Candidates for Start-Up in Chronological Order539BCKing Cyruss' degree for Israel to go up to Jerusalem and build. This event is prophesied by Isaiah 44:28, fulfilled in Ezra chapter 1.516BCKing Darius the 1st of Persia's decree for the elders of Israel to build God's Temple at Jerusalem. Recorded in Ezra chapter 6.458/457BCBased on King Artaxerxes decree to Ezra to return to Jerusalem and re-establish the Law and to rebuild the Temple and the practice of the Law in the Temple. This event is recorded in Ezra chapter 7 (also see Ezra 9:9).445/444BCBased on Nehemiah's Petition to King Artaxerxes to return to Jerusalem. This event is recorded in Nehemiah chapter 2.
10b. Selection 548/547BC; The DistinguishingCharacter of the Restoration of the LawOf these candidates, one is outstanding in its character in that it involves the restoration of the Law of God. Friends, all of these historic events and decrees listed above involved physical building of Jerusalem, it's walls, etc. But remember our God who has said;Psalms 127:1 (NIV)1 A Song of degrees for Solomon. Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.10c. The Spiritual vs the Purely PhysicalOne can lay bricks, build walls, and create a city, but unless the God of the Bible, His name is YHVH or Jehovah in English, is the center of its purpose then all will be in vain. And remembering that this is a prophecy where God answered Daniel's prayer for a physical deliverance from bondage,with a spiritual deliverance from sin and transgression through this Messiah who would come, then noting the fact that the 548/547BC event of Ezra's journey to reestablish the Law and to build is a wise choice.Ezra's task and mission and the decree of King Artaxerxes is found in Ezra chapter 7, and it is important also to consider Ezra 9:9.Ezra 9:99 For we were bondmen; yet our God hath not forsaken us in our bondage, but hath extended mercy unto us in the sight of the kings of Persia, to give us a reviving, to set up the house of our God, and to repair the desolations thereof, and to give us a wall in Judah and in Jerusalem.11. The Calculations Relative to 458/457BC11a. Absence of the Year Zero on the Julian CalendarThe Jullian Calendar passes from 1BC to 1AD with no year "zero". Whenever determining time passages between years we must add one year to our calculations because of this missing year zero. The opposite is true when calculating which year we will arrive at when the time passage is known, in which case we must subtract one year. Here is an example chart to illustrate:
11b. Determining Time Passage When Dates Are GivenThough we would normally expect to count 10 years of time passage between the year 5BC and 5AD, there is actually only nine years because of the missing year zero. Therefore we must SUBTRACT one year in such calculations. A working formula for known Dates dermining time would be;Determining Time Passage with Given Dates:YearBC + YearAD - 1 = Total Time Passage in Years5BC + 5AD - 1 = 9 yearsDetermining Date with Time Passage Given:YearBC + TimePassage + 1 = YearAD5BC + 9years + 1 = 5ADor from AD to BCYearAD - TimePassage + 1 = YearBC5AD - 9years + (-1) = -5BC11c. Determining A Date with a Given Time Passage:Though we would normally expect to count 10 years of time passage between the year 5BC and 5AD, there is actually only nine years because of the missing year zero. Therefore we must ADD one year in such calculations. A working formula for known time passage dermining a date would be shown above.11d. The Seventy Weeks TranslatedDaniel 9:24-2724 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.Verse 24 - Seventy "Weeks" is 490 Years:70 X 7 = 49025 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.Verse 25 part(a) - Seven "Weeks" is 49 Years:7 X 7 = 49Verse 25 part(b) - Three Score and Two "Weeks" is 434 Years:62 X 7 = 434Added together:49 + 434 = 48327 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.Verse 27 - One "Week" Remains:1 X 7 = 7Added together:(Verse 25) 483 + 7 (Verse 27)= 49011e. The 458/457BC CalculationHaving now completed the preliminary calculations we process the information given by the Angel Gabriel into the start-up date of 458BC.The Formula: YearBC + TimePassage + 1 = YearAD458/457BC + 483 + 1 = 26/27ADThis will place the Baptism of Yeshua of Nazareth at this 26 or 27AD placing His Crucifixion at approximately 30AD. Also...458 + 490 + 1 = 33AD... approximately 3 years after a 30AD crucifixion.11f. The Baptism of Yeshua Approximately 27ADThe Baptism of the Lord Jesus Christ is linked with the 15th Year of Tiberius Caesar by Luke 3:1, because this is the year that John the Baptist announced Yeshua as the Lamb of God and baptised Him.Luke 3:1Luk 3:1 Now in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar, Pontius Pilate being governor of Judaea, and Herod being tetrarch of Galilee, and his brother Philip tetrarch of Ituraea and of the region of Trachonitis, and Lysanias the tetrarch of Abilene,The fifteenth year of Tiberius Caesar is often stated as beginning in 14AD, but that is a surface level assessment, only. That statement does not consider the co-regency reign of Tiberius Caesar which began 2 years earlier as is cited by early Christian writer Tertullian who documented this coregent rule.This places the baptism of the Lord Jesus Christ exactly at 27AD, perfectly fulfilling the prophecy at the end of the 69th week, exactly as does Daniel 9:25, as 7 weeks and 62 weeks = 69 weeks (483 years). Verse 25 clearly states this to be the timing of the arrival of Messiah.Daniel 9:2525 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.From: http://bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Def.show/RTD/ISBE/ID/8768Tiberius is mentioned by name only once in the New Testament (Luke 3:1): "the 15th year of the reign (hegemonia) of Tiberius." The question is, From what date is this to be reckoned--the date of Tiberius's co-regency, 13 (or 11) AD, or from his accession, 14 AD?From: http://www.doig.net/NTC12.htmTiberius became Caesar on August 19, 14, and in that year Dios 1 fell on October 15. Thus, his first regnal year according to the Syro-Macedonian calendar would be from Dios 1, or October 25, 13 until October 14, 14.Luke would have measured the fifteen years from that year one by non-accession, or inclusive, reckoning. Thus, the "fifteenth year" fell from October 20, 27 to October 9, 28. According to Luke's Syro-Macedonian reckoning John the Baptist began his ministry between these two dates. This falls in line with the arrival of Pontius Pilate by the autumn of 27. The earliest first Passover of Jesus' ministry would have been in 28.11g. The Crucifixion of Yeshua in 30AD as opposed to 33ADThe date of the year 30AD is considered be the correct date of the crucifixion of Yeshua of Nazareth for two reasons. One is the above determination of the date of His water baptism. Two is the fact that some do not accept the Friday crucifixion and prior to Sunday morning before the Sun arose resurrection timing. That is because the believe these words spoken by Jesus, without adulteration.Matthew 12:4040 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.The idea of a 33AD Friday afternoon to before Sunday morning idea does not fulfill these words of Christ and should be discounted. The year 30AD would provide for a Wednesday crucifixion following this time table.11h. Completion of the Prophecy... The Last WeekWith the 69 weeks of the Prophecy calculated, we have only one week remaining. So far we have place the ascent of Messiah exactly where verse 25 places Him, exactly 69 weeks (483 years) after our start up date of 458 BC. With Biblical support that will be stated in the next segment, we see Messiah Yeshua "cut off" after the 69th week as verse 26 clearly reads;Daniel 9:2626 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.Not only do our calculations perfectly align with the conclusion of week 69 but it places the 30AD crucifixion of Yeshua of Nazareth exactly in the middle of the 70th week where verse 27 states that His sacrifice caused the oblation (sacrifices in the Temple) to end. We do well remember the veil of the Temple being torn in two, upon our Saviour's death. This was an indication that the atonement for sins had been completed and no longer would an animal sacrifice be sufficient to atone for sins. Only the blood of the Messiah, the LAMB of God can now do that.Daniel 9:2727 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
The 70 Weeks of Daniel
"The 70 Weeks of Daniel"Contiguous / Unbroken“THOUGH THIS PRESENTATION DOES NOT REFLECT MY OWN VIEW, THAT THE REMAINING HALF OF THE SEVENTIETH WEEK IS A FUTURE EVENT: THIS ARTICLE CERTAINLY REPRESENTS A FAITHFUL INTERPRETATION OF DANIEL 9:26-27 AS FAR AS THAT POINT DESCRIBED AS----“THE MIDST OF THE WEEK”. AS I HAVE SAID-------I BELIEVE THAT THE REMAINING 3 ½ YEARS. [the GREAT TRIBULATION] IS A FUTURE EVENT !” I DO NOT KNOW THE AUTHOR. Danny McDowellDetermining the Starting Point for the Seventy Weeks Prophecy10a. There are four historic events to choose from;Upon the conquering of Babylon by Cyrus, King of Persia and the Medes/Persian Empire, He made a decree that God had revealed to Him that Israel should be set free of their captivity, and Cyrus decreed that whosoever would, should go up to Jerusalem and rebuild the temple to the one God YHVH.This God inspired act set off a series of four events in History by several Kings of the Medes/Persian Empire. Here are four candidate, Start-Up dates to choose from for the beginning of the "Seventy Weeks" prophecy.Candidates for Start-Up in Chronological Order539BCKing Cyruss' degree for Israel to go up to Jerusalem and build. This event is prophesied by Isaiah 44:28, fulfilled in Ezra chapter 1.516BCKing Darius the 1st of Persia's decree for the elders of Israel to build God's Temple at Jerusalem. Recorded in Ezra chapter 6.458/457BCBased on King Artaxerxes decree to Ezra to return to Jerusalem and re-establish the Law and to rebuild the Temple and the practice of the Law in the Temple. This event is recorded in Ezra chapter 7 (also see Ezra 9:9).445/444BCBased on Nehemiah's Petition to King Artaxerxes to return to Jerusalem. This event is recorded in Nehemiah chapter 2.
10b. Selection 548/547BC; The DistinguishingCharacter of the Restoration of the LawOf these candidates, one is outstanding in its character in that it involves the restoration of the Law of God. Friends, all of these historic events and decrees listed above involved physical building of Jerusalem, it's walls, etc. But remember our God who has said;Psalms 127:1 (NIV)1 A Song of degrees for Solomon. Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.10c. The Spiritual vs the Purely PhysicalOne can lay bricks, build walls, and create a city, but unless the God of the Bible, His name is YHVH or Jehovah in English, is the center of its purpose then all will be in vain. And remembering that this is a prophecy where God answered Daniel's prayer for a physical deliverance from bondage,with a spiritual deliverance from sin and transgression through this Messiah who would come, then noting the fact that the 548/547BC event of Ezra's journey to reestablish the Law and to build is a wise choice.Ezra's task and mission and the decree of King Artaxerxes is found in Ezra chapter 7, and it is important also to consider Ezra 9:9.Ezra 9:99 For we were bondmen; yet our God hath not forsaken us in our bondage, but hath extended mercy unto us in the sight of the kings of Persia, to give us a reviving, to set up the house of our God, and to repair the desolations thereof, and to give us a wall in Judah and in Jerusalem.11. The Calculations Relative to 458/457BC11a. Absence of the Year Zero on the Julian CalendarThe Jullian Calendar passes from 1BC to 1AD with no year "zero". Whenever determining time passages between years we must add one year to our calculations because of this missing year zero. The opposite is true when calculating which year we will arrive at when the time passage is known, in which case we must subtract one year. Here is an example chart to illustrate:
11b. Determining Time Passage When Dates Are GivenThough we would normally expect to count 10 years of time passage between the year 5BC and 5AD, there is actually only nine years because of the missing year zero. Therefore we must SUBTRACT one year in such calculations. A working formula for known Dates dermining time would be;Determining Time Passage with Given Dates:YearBC + YearAD - 1 = Total Time Passage in Years5BC + 5AD - 1 = 9 yearsDetermining Date with Time Passage Given:YearBC + TimePassage + 1 = YearAD5BC + 9years + 1 = 5ADor from AD to BCYearAD - TimePassage + 1 = YearBC5AD - 9years + (-1) = -5BC11c. Determining A Date with a Given Time Passage:Though we would normally expect to count 10 years of time passage between the year 5BC and 5AD, there is actually only nine years because of the missing year zero. Therefore we must ADD one year in such calculations. A working formula for known time passage dermining a date would be shown above.11d. The Seventy Weeks TranslatedDaniel 9:24-2724 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.Verse 24 - Seventy "Weeks" is 490 Years:70 X 7 = 49025 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.Verse 25 part(a) - Seven "Weeks" is 49 Years:7 X 7 = 49Verse 25 part(b) - Three Score and Two "Weeks" is 434 Years:62 X 7 = 434Added together:49 + 434 = 48327 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.Verse 27 - One "Week" Remains:1 X 7 = 7Added together:(Verse 25) 483 + 7 (Verse 27)= 49011e. The 458/457BC CalculationHaving now completed the preliminary calculations we process the information given by the Angel Gabriel into the start-up date of 458BC.The Formula: YearBC + TimePassage + 1 = YearAD458/457BC + 483 + 1 = 26/27ADThis will place the Baptism of Yeshua of Nazareth at this 26 or 27AD placing His Crucifixion at approximately 30AD. Also...458 + 490 + 1 = 33AD... approximately 3 years after a 30AD crucifixion.11f. The Baptism of Yeshua Approximately 27ADThe Baptism of the Lord Jesus Christ is linked with the 15th Year of Tiberius Caesar by Luke 3:1, because this is the year that John the Baptist announced Yeshua as the Lamb of God and baptised Him.Luke 3:1Luk 3:1 Now in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar, Pontius Pilate being governor of Judaea, and Herod being tetrarch of Galilee, and his brother Philip tetrarch of Ituraea and of the region of Trachonitis, and Lysanias the tetrarch of Abilene,The fifteenth year of Tiberius Caesar is often stated as beginning in 14AD, but that is a surface level assessment, only. That statement does not consider the co-regency reign of Tiberius Caesar which began 2 years earlier as is cited by early Christian writer Tertullian who documented this coregent rule.This places the baptism of the Lord Jesus Christ exactly at 27AD, perfectly fulfilling the prophecy at the end of the 69th week, exactly as does Daniel 9:25, as 7 weeks and 62 weeks = 69 weeks (483 years). Verse 25 clearly states this to be the timing of the arrival of Messiah.Daniel 9:2525 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.From: http://bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Def.show/RTD/ISBE/ID/8768Tiberius is mentioned by name only once in the New Testament (Luke 3:1): "the 15th year of the reign (hegemonia) of Tiberius." The question is, From what date is this to be reckoned--the date of Tiberius's co-regency, 13 (or 11) AD, or from his accession, 14 AD?From: http://www.doig.net/NTC12.htmTiberius became Caesar on August 19, 14, and in that year Dios 1 fell on October 15. Thus, his first regnal year according to the Syro-Macedonian calendar would be from Dios 1, or October 25, 13 until October 14, 14.Luke would have measured the fifteen years from that year one by non-accession, or inclusive, reckoning. Thus, the "fifteenth year" fell from October 20, 27 to October 9, 28. According to Luke's Syro-Macedonian reckoning John the Baptist began his ministry between these two dates. This falls in line with the arrival of Pontius Pilate by the autumn of 27. The earliest first Passover of Jesus' ministry would have been in 28.11g. The Crucifixion of Yeshua in 30AD as opposed to 33ADThe date of the year 30AD is considered be the correct date of the crucifixion of Yeshua of Nazareth for two reasons. One is the above determination of the date of His water baptism. Two is the fact that some do not accept the Friday crucifixion and prior to Sunday morning before the Sun arose resurrection timing. That is because the believe these words spoken by Jesus, without adulteration.Matthew 12:4040 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.The idea of a 33AD Friday afternoon to before Sunday morning idea does not fulfill these words of Christ and should be discounted. The year 30AD would provide for a Wednesday crucifixion following this time table.11h. Completion of the Prophecy... The Last WeekWith the 69 weeks of the Prophecy calculated, we have only one week remaining. So far we have place the ascent of Messiah exactly where verse 25 places Him, exactly 69 weeks (483 years) after our start up date of 458 BC. With Biblical support that will be stated in the next segment, we see Messiah Yeshua "cut off" after the 69th week as verse 26 clearly reads;Daniel 9:2626 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.Not only do our calculations perfectly align with the conclusion of week 69 but it places the 30AD crucifixion of Yeshua of Nazareth exactly in the middle of the 70th week where verse 27 states that His sacrifice caused the oblation (sacrifices in the Temple) to end. We do well remember the veil of the Temple being torn in two, upon our Saviour's death. This was an indication that the atonement for sins had been completed and no longer would an animal sacrifice be sufficient to atone for sins. Only the blood of the Messiah, the LAMB of God can now do that.Daniel 9:2727 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
FAMOUS RAPTURE WATCHERS---DAVE MAC PHEARSON
Oct 24, 2007
Famous Rapture Watchers
By Dave MacPherson
The following quotes - to which a couple more have been added - were first circulated in a little-known, non-copyrighted paper of mine in the 1970's. While noting how Rev. 3:10 has been interpreted by the greatest Greek experts, can you determine the rapture view of each of the leaders herein?
Barnabas (40-100): "The final stumbling-block (or source of danger) approaches...for the whole [past] time of your faith will profit you nothing, unless now in this wicked time we also withstand coming sources of danger....That the Black One [Antichrist] may find no means of entrance..." (Epistle of Barnabas, 4).
Clement of Rome (40-100): "...the Scripture also bears witness, saying, 'Speedily will He come, and will not tarry'; and, 'The Lord shall suddenly come [Matthew 24:30 coming] to His temple, even the Holy One, for whom ye look'" (I Clement, 23).
Hermas (40-140): "Those, therefore, who continue steadfast, and are put through the fire [of the Great Tribulation that is yet to come], will be purified by means of it....Wherefore cease not speaking these things into the ears of the saints..." (The Pastor of Hermas, Vision 4).
Polycarp (70-167): "He comes as the Judge of the living and the dead" (Epistle to the Philippians, II).
Justin Martyr (100-168): "The man of apostasy [Antichrist], who speaks strange things against the Most High, shall venture to do unlawful deeds on the earth against us the Christians..." (Dialogue With Trypho, 110).
Melito (100-170): "For with all his strength did the adversary assail us, even then giving a foretaste of his activity among us [during the Great Tribulation] which is to be without restraint..." (Discourse on the Resurrection, i, 8).
Irenaeus (140-202): "And they [the ten kings who shall arise] shall lay Babylon waste, and burn her with fire, and shall give their kingdom to the beast, and put the church to flight" (Against Heresies, V, 26).
Tertullian (150-220): "The souls of the martyrs are taught to wait [Rev. 6]...that the beast Antichrist with his false prophet may wage war on the Church of God..." (On the Resurrection of the Flesh, 25).
Hippolytus (160-240): "...the one thousand two hundred and three score days (the half of the week) during which the tyrant is to reign and persecute the Church, which flees from city to city, and seeks concealment in the wilderness among the mountains" (Treatise on Christ and Antichrist, 61).
Cyprian (200-258): "The day of affliction has begun to hang over our heads, and the end of the world and the time of the Antichrist to draw near, so that we must all stand prepared for the battle..." (Epistle, 55, 1).
Victorinus (240-303): "...the times of Antichrist, when all shall be injured" (Commentary on the Apocalypse of the Blessed John, VI, 5).
Lactantius (240-330): "And power will be given him [Antichrist] to desolate the whole earth for forty-two months....When these things shall so happen, then the righteous and the followers of truth shall separate themselves from the wicked, and flee into solitudes" (Divine Institutes, VII, 17).
Athanasius (293-373): "...they have not spared Thy servants, but are preparing the way for Antichrist" (History of the Arians, VIII, 79).
Ephraim the Syrian (306-373): "Nothing remains then, except that the coming of our enemy, Antichrist, appear..." (Sermo Asceticus, I).
Pseudo-Ephraem (4th century?): "...there is not other which remains, except the advent of the wicked one [Antichrist]..." (On the Last Times, the Antichrist etc., 2).
Cyril of Jerusalem (315-386): "The Church declares to thee the things concerning Antichrist before they arrive...it is well that, knowing these things, thou shouldest make thyself ready beforehand" (Catechetical Lectures, 15, 9).
Jerome (340-420): "I told you that Christ would not come unless Antichrist had come before" (Epistle 21).
Chrysostom (345-407): "...the time of Antichrist...will be a sign of the coming of Christ..." (Homilies on First Thessalonians, 9).
Augustine (354-430): "But he who reads this passage [Daniel 12], even half asleep, cannot fail to see that the kingdom of Antichrist shall fiercely, though for a short time, assail the Church..." (The City of God, XX, 23).
Venerable Bede (673-735): "[The Church's triumph will] follow the reign of Antichrist" (The Explanation of the Apocalypse, II, 8).
Bernard of Clairvaux (1090-1153): "There remains only one thing----that the demon of noonday [Antichrist] should appear, to seduce those who remain still in Christ..." (Sermons on the Song of Songs, 33, 16).
Roger Bacon (1214-1274): "...because of future perils [for the Church] in the times of Antichrist..." (Opus Majus, II, p. 634).
John Wycliffe (1320-1384): "Wherefore let us pray to God that he keep us in the hour of temptation, which is coming upon all the world, Rev. iii" (Writings of the Reverend and Learned John Wickliff, D.D., p. 155).
Martin Luther (1483-1546): "[The book of Revelation] is intended as a revelation of things that are to happen in the future, and especially of tribulations and disasters for the Church..." (Works of Martin Luther, VI, p. 481).
William Tyndale (1492-1536): "...antichrist preacheth not Peter's doctrine (which is Christ's gospel)...he compelleth all men with violence of sword" (Greenslade's The Work of William Tindale, p. 127).
Menno Simons (1496-1561): "...He will appear as a triumphant prince and a victorious king to bring judgment. Then will those who persecute us look upon Him..." (Complete Writings..., p. 622).
John Calvin (1509-1564): "...we ought to follow in our inquiries after Antichrist, especially where such pride proceeds to a public desolation of the church" (Institutes, Vol. 2, p. 411).
John Knox (1515-1572): "...the great love of God towards his Church, whom he pleased to forewarn of dangers to come, so many years before they come to pass...to wit, The man of sin, The Antichrist, The Whore of Babylon" (The History of the Reformation..., I, p. 76).
John Fox (1516-1587): "...that second beast prophesied to come in the later time of the Church...to disturb the whole Church of Christ..." (Acts and Monuments, I).
Roger Williams (1603-1683): "Antichrist...hath his prisons, to keep Christ Jesus and his members fast..." (The Bloody Tenent, of Persecution, p. 153).
John Bunyan (1628-1688): "He comes in flaming fire [as Judge] and...the trump of God sounds in the air, the dead to hear his voice..." (The Last Four Things: Of Judgment).
Daniel Whitby (1638-1726): "...after the Fall of Antichrist, there shall be such a glorious State of the Church...so shall this be the Church of Martyrs, and of those who had not received the Mark of the Beast..." (A Paraphrase and Commentary, p. 696).
Increase Mather (1639-1723): "That part of the world [Europe] was to be principally the Seat of the Church of Christ during the Reign of Antichrist" (Ichabod, p. 64).
Matthew Henry (1662-1714): "Those who keep the gospel in a time of peace shall be kept by Christ in an hour of temptation [Revelation 3:10]" (Commentary, VI, p. 1134).
Cotton Mather (1663-1728): "...that New Jerusalem, whereto the Church is to be advanced, when the Mystical Babylon shall be fallen" (The Wonders of the Invisible World, p. 3).
Jonathan Edwards (1703-1758): "...continuance of Antichrist's reign [when the Church is persecuted] did not commence before the year of Christ 479..." (A History of the Work of Redemption, p. 217).
John Wesley (1703-1791): "'The stars shall...fall from heaven,' (Revelation, vi. 13)....And then shall be heard the universal shout...followed by the 'voice of the archangel,'...'and the trumpet of God'...(I Thessalonians iv. 16)." (The Works of the Rev. John Wesley, A.M., Vol. V, p. 173).
George Whitefield (1714-1770): "...'while the bridegroom tarried,' in the space of time which passeth between our Lord's ascension and his coming again to judgment..." (Gillies' Memoirs of Rev. George Whitefield, p. 471).
David Brainerd (1718-1747): "...and I could not but hope, that the time was at hand, when Babylon the great would fall and rise no more" (Memoirs..., p. 326).
Morgan Edwards (1722-1795): "[Antichrist] has hitherto assumed no higher title than 'the vicar general of Christ on earth'..." (Two Academical Exercises etc., p. 20).
John Newton (1725-1807): "'Fear not temptation's fiery day, for I will be thy strength and stay. Thou hast my promise, hold it fast, the trying hour [Revelation 3:10] will soon be past'" (The Works of the Rev. John Newton, Vol. II, p. 152).
Adam Clarke (1762-1832): "We which are alive, and remain...he [Paul] is speaking of the genuine Christians which shall be found on earth when Christ comes to judgment" (Commentary, Vol. VI, p. 550).
Charles G. Finney (1792-1875): "Christ represents it as impossible to deceive the elect. Matt. 24:24. We have seen that the elect unto salvation includes all true christians." (Lectures on Systematic Theology, p. 606).
Charles Hodge (1797-1878): "...the fate of his Church here on earth...is the burden of the Apocalypse" (Systematic Theology, Vol. III, p. 827).
Albert Barnes (1798-1870): "...he will keep them in the future trials that shall come upon the world [Revelation 3:10]" (Notes on the New Testament, p. 94).
George Mueller (1805-1898): "The Scripture declares plainly that the Lord Jesus will not come until the Apostacy shall have taken place, and the man of sin...shall have been revealed..." (Mrs. Mueller's Missionary Tours and Labours, p. 148).
Benjamin W. Newton (1805-1898): "The Secret Rapture was bad enough, but this [John Darby's equally novel idea that the book of Matthew is on 'Jewish' ground instead of 'Church' ground] was worse" (unpublished Fry MS. and F. Roy Coad's Prophetic Developments, p. 29).
R. C. Trench (1807-1886): "...the Philadelphian church...to be kept in temptation, not to be exempted from temptation..." (Seven Churches of Asia, pp. 183-184).
Carl F. Keil (1807-1888): "...the persecution of the last enemy Antichrist against the church of the Lord..." (Biblical Commentary, Vol. XXXIV, p. 503).
Henry Alford (1810-1871): "Christ is on His way to this earth [I Thessalonians 4:17]..." (The New Testament for English Readers, Vol. II, p. 491).
John Lillie (1812-1867): "In his [Antichrist's] days was to be the great----the last----tribulation of the Church" (Second Thessalonians, pp. 537-538).
F. L. Godet (1812-1900): "The gathering of the elect [Matthew 24:31]...is mentioned by St. Paul, 1 Thess. 4:16, 17, 2 Thess. 2:1..." (Commentary on Luke, p. 452).
Robert Murray McCheyne (1813-1842): "Christians must have 'great tribulation'; but they come out of it" (Bonar's Memoirs of McCheyne, p. 26).
S. P. Tregelles (1813-1875): "The Scripture teaches the Church to wait for the manifestation of Christ. The secret theory bids us to expect a coming before any such manifestation" (The Hope of Christ's Second Coming, p. 71).
Franz Delitzsch (1813-1890): "...the approaching day is the day of Christ, who comes...for final judgment" (Commentary on Hebrews, Vol. II, p. 183).
C. J. Ellicott (1819-1905): "[I Thessalonians 4:17] 'to meet the Lord,' as He is coming down to earth..." (Commentary on the Thessalonian Epistles, p. 66).
Nathaniel West (1826-1906): "[The Pre-Trib Rapture] is built on a postulate, vicious in logic, violent in exegesis, contrary to experience, repudiated by the early Church, contradicted by the testimony of eighteen hundred years...and condemned by all the standard scholars of every age" (The Apostle Paul and the "Any Moment" Theory, p. 30).
Alexander Maclaren (1826-1910): "He will keep us in the midst of, and also from, the hour of temptation [Revelation 3:10]" (The Epistles of John, Jude and the Book of Revelation, p. 266).
J. H. Thayer (1828-1901): "To keep [Revelation 3:10]:...by guarding, to cause one to escape in safety out of" (A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, p. 622).
Adolph Saphir (1831-1891): "...the advent of the Messiah...to which both the believing synagogue and the church of the Lord Jesus Christ are looking..." (The Epistle to the Hebrews, Vol. I, p. 96).
M. R. Vincent (1834-1922): "The preposition ['from'] implies, not a keeping from temptation, but a keeping in temptation [Revelation 3:10]..." (Word Studies..., p. 466).
William J. Erdman (1834-1923): "...by the 'saints' seen as future by Daniel and by John are meant 'the Church'..." (Notes on the Book of Revelation, p. 47).
H. Grattan Guinness (1835-1910): "...the Church is on earth during the action of the Apocalypse..." (The Approaching End of the Age, p. 136).
H. B. Swete (1835-1917): "The promise [of Revelation 3:10], as Bede says, is 'not indeed of your being immune from adversity, but of not being overcome by it'" (The Apocalypse of St. John, p. 56).
William G. Moorehead (1836-1914): "...the last days of the Church's deepest humiliation when Antichrist is practicing and prospering (Dan. viii:12)..." (Outline Studies in the New Testament, p. 123).
A. H. Strong (1836-1921): "The final coming of Christ is referred to in: Mat. 24:30...[and] I Thess. 4:16..." (Systematic Theology, p. 567).
Theodor Zahn (1838-1933): "...He will preserve...at the time of the great temptation [Revelation 3:10]..." (Zahn-Kommentar, I, p. 305).
I. T. Beckwith (1843-1936): "The Philadelphians...are promised that they shall be carried in safety through the great trial [Revelation 3:10], they shall not fall" (The Apocalypse of John, p. 484).
Robert Cameron (1845-1922): "The Coming for, and the Coming with, the saints, still persists, although it involves a manifest contradiction, viz., two Second Comings which is an absurdity" (Scriptural Truth About the Lord's Return, p. 16).
B. B. Warfield (1851-1921): "...He shall come again to judgment...to close the dispensation of grace..." (Biblical Doctrines, p. 639).
David Baron (1855-1926): "(Tit. ii. 13), for then the hope as regards the church, and Israel, and the world, will be fully realised" (Visions of Zechariah, p. 323).
Philip Mauro (1859-1952): "...'dispensational teaching' is modernistic in the strictest sense...it first came into existence within the memory of persons now living..." (The Gospel of the Kingdom, p. 8).
A. T. Robertson (1863-1934): "In Rev. 3:10...we seem to have the picture of general temptation with the preservation of the saints" (A Grammar of the Greek New Testament in the Light of Historical Research, p. 596).
R. C. H. Lenski (1864-1936): "...it [Philadelphia] shall be kept untouched and unharmed by the impending dangers [Revelation 3:10]" (The Interpretation of St. John's Revelation, pp. 146-146).
William E. Biederwolf (1867-1939): "Godet, like most pre-millennial expositors, makes no provision for any period between the Lord's coming for His saints and His coming with them..." (The Second Coming Bible, p. 385).
Alexander Reese (1881-1969): "...we quite deliberately reject the dispensational theories, propounded first about 1830..." (The Approaching Advent of Christ, p. 293).
Norman S. MacPherson (1899-1980): "...the view that the Church will not pass into or through the Great Tribulation is based largely upon arbitrary interpretations of obscure passages" (Triumph Through Tribulation, p. 5).
Famous Rapture Watchers
By Dave MacPherson
The following quotes - to which a couple more have been added - were first circulated in a little-known, non-copyrighted paper of mine in the 1970's. While noting how Rev. 3:10 has been interpreted by the greatest Greek experts, can you determine the rapture view of each of the leaders herein?
Barnabas (40-100): "The final stumbling-block (or source of danger) approaches...for the whole [past] time of your faith will profit you nothing, unless now in this wicked time we also withstand coming sources of danger....That the Black One [Antichrist] may find no means of entrance..." (Epistle of Barnabas, 4).
Clement of Rome (40-100): "...the Scripture also bears witness, saying, 'Speedily will He come, and will not tarry'; and, 'The Lord shall suddenly come [Matthew 24:30 coming] to His temple, even the Holy One, for whom ye look'" (I Clement, 23).
Hermas (40-140): "Those, therefore, who continue steadfast, and are put through the fire [of the Great Tribulation that is yet to come], will be purified by means of it....Wherefore cease not speaking these things into the ears of the saints..." (The Pastor of Hermas, Vision 4).
Polycarp (70-167): "He comes as the Judge of the living and the dead" (Epistle to the Philippians, II).
Justin Martyr (100-168): "The man of apostasy [Antichrist], who speaks strange things against the Most High, shall venture to do unlawful deeds on the earth against us the Christians..." (Dialogue With Trypho, 110).
Melito (100-170): "For with all his strength did the adversary assail us, even then giving a foretaste of his activity among us [during the Great Tribulation] which is to be without restraint..." (Discourse on the Resurrection, i, 8).
Irenaeus (140-202): "And they [the ten kings who shall arise] shall lay Babylon waste, and burn her with fire, and shall give their kingdom to the beast, and put the church to flight" (Against Heresies, V, 26).
Tertullian (150-220): "The souls of the martyrs are taught to wait [Rev. 6]...that the beast Antichrist with his false prophet may wage war on the Church of God..." (On the Resurrection of the Flesh, 25).
Hippolytus (160-240): "...the one thousand two hundred and three score days (the half of the week) during which the tyrant is to reign and persecute the Church, which flees from city to city, and seeks concealment in the wilderness among the mountains" (Treatise on Christ and Antichrist, 61).
Cyprian (200-258): "The day of affliction has begun to hang over our heads, and the end of the world and the time of the Antichrist to draw near, so that we must all stand prepared for the battle..." (Epistle, 55, 1).
Victorinus (240-303): "...the times of Antichrist, when all shall be injured" (Commentary on the Apocalypse of the Blessed John, VI, 5).
Lactantius (240-330): "And power will be given him [Antichrist] to desolate the whole earth for forty-two months....When these things shall so happen, then the righteous and the followers of truth shall separate themselves from the wicked, and flee into solitudes" (Divine Institutes, VII, 17).
Athanasius (293-373): "...they have not spared Thy servants, but are preparing the way for Antichrist" (History of the Arians, VIII, 79).
Ephraim the Syrian (306-373): "Nothing remains then, except that the coming of our enemy, Antichrist, appear..." (Sermo Asceticus, I).
Pseudo-Ephraem (4th century?): "...there is not other which remains, except the advent of the wicked one [Antichrist]..." (On the Last Times, the Antichrist etc., 2).
Cyril of Jerusalem (315-386): "The Church declares to thee the things concerning Antichrist before they arrive...it is well that, knowing these things, thou shouldest make thyself ready beforehand" (Catechetical Lectures, 15, 9).
Jerome (340-420): "I told you that Christ would not come unless Antichrist had come before" (Epistle 21).
Chrysostom (345-407): "...the time of Antichrist...will be a sign of the coming of Christ..." (Homilies on First Thessalonians, 9).
Augustine (354-430): "But he who reads this passage [Daniel 12], even half asleep, cannot fail to see that the kingdom of Antichrist shall fiercely, though for a short time, assail the Church..." (The City of God, XX, 23).
Venerable Bede (673-735): "[The Church's triumph will] follow the reign of Antichrist" (The Explanation of the Apocalypse, II, 8).
Bernard of Clairvaux (1090-1153): "There remains only one thing----that the demon of noonday [Antichrist] should appear, to seduce those who remain still in Christ..." (Sermons on the Song of Songs, 33, 16).
Roger Bacon (1214-1274): "...because of future perils [for the Church] in the times of Antichrist..." (Opus Majus, II, p. 634).
John Wycliffe (1320-1384): "Wherefore let us pray to God that he keep us in the hour of temptation, which is coming upon all the world, Rev. iii" (Writings of the Reverend and Learned John Wickliff, D.D., p. 155).
Martin Luther (1483-1546): "[The book of Revelation] is intended as a revelation of things that are to happen in the future, and especially of tribulations and disasters for the Church..." (Works of Martin Luther, VI, p. 481).
William Tyndale (1492-1536): "...antichrist preacheth not Peter's doctrine (which is Christ's gospel)...he compelleth all men with violence of sword" (Greenslade's The Work of William Tindale, p. 127).
Menno Simons (1496-1561): "...He will appear as a triumphant prince and a victorious king to bring judgment. Then will those who persecute us look upon Him..." (Complete Writings..., p. 622).
John Calvin (1509-1564): "...we ought to follow in our inquiries after Antichrist, especially where such pride proceeds to a public desolation of the church" (Institutes, Vol. 2, p. 411).
John Knox (1515-1572): "...the great love of God towards his Church, whom he pleased to forewarn of dangers to come, so many years before they come to pass...to wit, The man of sin, The Antichrist, The Whore of Babylon" (The History of the Reformation..., I, p. 76).
John Fox (1516-1587): "...that second beast prophesied to come in the later time of the Church...to disturb the whole Church of Christ..." (Acts and Monuments, I).
Roger Williams (1603-1683): "Antichrist...hath his prisons, to keep Christ Jesus and his members fast..." (The Bloody Tenent, of Persecution, p. 153).
John Bunyan (1628-1688): "He comes in flaming fire [as Judge] and...the trump of God sounds in the air, the dead to hear his voice..." (The Last Four Things: Of Judgment).
Daniel Whitby (1638-1726): "...after the Fall of Antichrist, there shall be such a glorious State of the Church...so shall this be the Church of Martyrs, and of those who had not received the Mark of the Beast..." (A Paraphrase and Commentary, p. 696).
Increase Mather (1639-1723): "That part of the world [Europe] was to be principally the Seat of the Church of Christ during the Reign of Antichrist" (Ichabod, p. 64).
Matthew Henry (1662-1714): "Those who keep the gospel in a time of peace shall be kept by Christ in an hour of temptation [Revelation 3:10]" (Commentary, VI, p. 1134).
Cotton Mather (1663-1728): "...that New Jerusalem, whereto the Church is to be advanced, when the Mystical Babylon shall be fallen" (The Wonders of the Invisible World, p. 3).
Jonathan Edwards (1703-1758): "...continuance of Antichrist's reign [when the Church is persecuted] did not commence before the year of Christ 479..." (A History of the Work of Redemption, p. 217).
John Wesley (1703-1791): "'The stars shall...fall from heaven,' (Revelation, vi. 13)....And then shall be heard the universal shout...followed by the 'voice of the archangel,'...'and the trumpet of God'...(I Thessalonians iv. 16)." (The Works of the Rev. John Wesley, A.M., Vol. V, p. 173).
George Whitefield (1714-1770): "...'while the bridegroom tarried,' in the space of time which passeth between our Lord's ascension and his coming again to judgment..." (Gillies' Memoirs of Rev. George Whitefield, p. 471).
David Brainerd (1718-1747): "...and I could not but hope, that the time was at hand, when Babylon the great would fall and rise no more" (Memoirs..., p. 326).
Morgan Edwards (1722-1795): "[Antichrist] has hitherto assumed no higher title than 'the vicar general of Christ on earth'..." (Two Academical Exercises etc., p. 20).
John Newton (1725-1807): "'Fear not temptation's fiery day, for I will be thy strength and stay. Thou hast my promise, hold it fast, the trying hour [Revelation 3:10] will soon be past'" (The Works of the Rev. John Newton, Vol. II, p. 152).
Adam Clarke (1762-1832): "We which are alive, and remain...he [Paul] is speaking of the genuine Christians which shall be found on earth when Christ comes to judgment" (Commentary, Vol. VI, p. 550).
Charles G. Finney (1792-1875): "Christ represents it as impossible to deceive the elect. Matt. 24:24. We have seen that the elect unto salvation includes all true christians." (Lectures on Systematic Theology, p. 606).
Charles Hodge (1797-1878): "...the fate of his Church here on earth...is the burden of the Apocalypse" (Systematic Theology, Vol. III, p. 827).
Albert Barnes (1798-1870): "...he will keep them in the future trials that shall come upon the world [Revelation 3:10]" (Notes on the New Testament, p. 94).
George Mueller (1805-1898): "The Scripture declares plainly that the Lord Jesus will not come until the Apostacy shall have taken place, and the man of sin...shall have been revealed..." (Mrs. Mueller's Missionary Tours and Labours, p. 148).
Benjamin W. Newton (1805-1898): "The Secret Rapture was bad enough, but this [John Darby's equally novel idea that the book of Matthew is on 'Jewish' ground instead of 'Church' ground] was worse" (unpublished Fry MS. and F. Roy Coad's Prophetic Developments, p. 29).
R. C. Trench (1807-1886): "...the Philadelphian church...to be kept in temptation, not to be exempted from temptation..." (Seven Churches of Asia, pp. 183-184).
Carl F. Keil (1807-1888): "...the persecution of the last enemy Antichrist against the church of the Lord..." (Biblical Commentary, Vol. XXXIV, p. 503).
Henry Alford (1810-1871): "Christ is on His way to this earth [I Thessalonians 4:17]..." (The New Testament for English Readers, Vol. II, p. 491).
John Lillie (1812-1867): "In his [Antichrist's] days was to be the great----the last----tribulation of the Church" (Second Thessalonians, pp. 537-538).
F. L. Godet (1812-1900): "The gathering of the elect [Matthew 24:31]...is mentioned by St. Paul, 1 Thess. 4:16, 17, 2 Thess. 2:1..." (Commentary on Luke, p. 452).
Robert Murray McCheyne (1813-1842): "Christians must have 'great tribulation'; but they come out of it" (Bonar's Memoirs of McCheyne, p. 26).
S. P. Tregelles (1813-1875): "The Scripture teaches the Church to wait for the manifestation of Christ. The secret theory bids us to expect a coming before any such manifestation" (The Hope of Christ's Second Coming, p. 71).
Franz Delitzsch (1813-1890): "...the approaching day is the day of Christ, who comes...for final judgment" (Commentary on Hebrews, Vol. II, p. 183).
C. J. Ellicott (1819-1905): "[I Thessalonians 4:17] 'to meet the Lord,' as He is coming down to earth..." (Commentary on the Thessalonian Epistles, p. 66).
Nathaniel West (1826-1906): "[The Pre-Trib Rapture] is built on a postulate, vicious in logic, violent in exegesis, contrary to experience, repudiated by the early Church, contradicted by the testimony of eighteen hundred years...and condemned by all the standard scholars of every age" (The Apostle Paul and the "Any Moment" Theory, p. 30).
Alexander Maclaren (1826-1910): "He will keep us in the midst of, and also from, the hour of temptation [Revelation 3:10]" (The Epistles of John, Jude and the Book of Revelation, p. 266).
J. H. Thayer (1828-1901): "To keep [Revelation 3:10]:...by guarding, to cause one to escape in safety out of" (A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, p. 622).
Adolph Saphir (1831-1891): "...the advent of the Messiah...to which both the believing synagogue and the church of the Lord Jesus Christ are looking..." (The Epistle to the Hebrews, Vol. I, p. 96).
M. R. Vincent (1834-1922): "The preposition ['from'] implies, not a keeping from temptation, but a keeping in temptation [Revelation 3:10]..." (Word Studies..., p. 466).
William J. Erdman (1834-1923): "...by the 'saints' seen as future by Daniel and by John are meant 'the Church'..." (Notes on the Book of Revelation, p. 47).
H. Grattan Guinness (1835-1910): "...the Church is on earth during the action of the Apocalypse..." (The Approaching End of the Age, p. 136).
H. B. Swete (1835-1917): "The promise [of Revelation 3:10], as Bede says, is 'not indeed of your being immune from adversity, but of not being overcome by it'" (The Apocalypse of St. John, p. 56).
William G. Moorehead (1836-1914): "...the last days of the Church's deepest humiliation when Antichrist is practicing and prospering (Dan. viii:12)..." (Outline Studies in the New Testament, p. 123).
A. H. Strong (1836-1921): "The final coming of Christ is referred to in: Mat. 24:30...[and] I Thess. 4:16..." (Systematic Theology, p. 567).
Theodor Zahn (1838-1933): "...He will preserve...at the time of the great temptation [Revelation 3:10]..." (Zahn-Kommentar, I, p. 305).
I. T. Beckwith (1843-1936): "The Philadelphians...are promised that they shall be carried in safety through the great trial [Revelation 3:10], they shall not fall" (The Apocalypse of John, p. 484).
Robert Cameron (1845-1922): "The Coming for, and the Coming with, the saints, still persists, although it involves a manifest contradiction, viz., two Second Comings which is an absurdity" (Scriptural Truth About the Lord's Return, p. 16).
B. B. Warfield (1851-1921): "...He shall come again to judgment...to close the dispensation of grace..." (Biblical Doctrines, p. 639).
David Baron (1855-1926): "(Tit. ii. 13), for then the hope as regards the church, and Israel, and the world, will be fully realised" (Visions of Zechariah, p. 323).
Philip Mauro (1859-1952): "...'dispensational teaching' is modernistic in the strictest sense...it first came into existence within the memory of persons now living..." (The Gospel of the Kingdom, p. 8).
A. T. Robertson (1863-1934): "In Rev. 3:10...we seem to have the picture of general temptation with the preservation of the saints" (A Grammar of the Greek New Testament in the Light of Historical Research, p. 596).
R. C. H. Lenski (1864-1936): "...it [Philadelphia] shall be kept untouched and unharmed by the impending dangers [Revelation 3:10]" (The Interpretation of St. John's Revelation, pp. 146-146).
William E. Biederwolf (1867-1939): "Godet, like most pre-millennial expositors, makes no provision for any period between the Lord's coming for His saints and His coming with them..." (The Second Coming Bible, p. 385).
Alexander Reese (1881-1969): "...we quite deliberately reject the dispensational theories, propounded first about 1830..." (The Approaching Advent of Christ, p. 293).
Norman S. MacPherson (1899-1980): "...the view that the Church will not pass into or through the Great Tribulation is based largely upon arbitrary interpretations of obscure passages" (Triumph Through Tribulation, p. 5).
Wednesday, November 26, 2008
Matthew 24---apologetics
Oct 24, 2007
Matthew 24 Olivet Discourse
Matthew 24Olivet Discourse
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. 2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? 4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. 6And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. 8All these are the beginning of sorrows. 9Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. 10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. 11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. 23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25Behold, I have told you before. 26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. 32Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. 35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. 36But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. 37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. 45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? 46Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 47Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. 48But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
It is said of those who teach the Pre-Tribulation Rapture, that the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24 and Mark 13) has little to do with the church today. The claim of pre-tribulation proponents is that the events of the Olivet discourse happen (for the most part) during the “seventieth week of Daniel”.
It is also taught that the entirety of the 70th week of Daniel is explicitly "synonymous" with the Day of the Lord. Since the Lord has promised to deliver the church from the Day of the Lord, then "CERTAINLY" the church must be raptured prior to the events of the Olivet Discourse.
Their explanation of the events in this discourse is thus: "The Olivet Discourse relates specifically to Tribulation Saints, Tribulation Jews and others who have been LEFT BEHIND following the rapture. There is a popular fictional novel in series as well as a movie (Left behind), which deals with many aspects of this doctrine. This is the prevailing position on the Olivet Discourse in evangelical Christianity in the western church today.
Let's see what the Bible says about this position.
The Rebuttal
"; document.write(lubid_string); //-->
Tell us, when shall these things be? what shall be the sign of thy coming and of the end of the world?............
....It is said in pre-tribulationism that Matthew 24 and Mark 13 (the Olivet Discourse) have "little if anything" to do with the church and the church age. It is proudly proclaimed that the church will be raptured from the earth prior to the events of the Olivet Discourse and that the only Christians That will see those events are those unsaved people who were "LEFT BEHIND" at the advent of the rapture. Let's take a close look at the Olivet Discourse and see if these claims are so.
Verse 3...."3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?".... Please note in verse 3, the Lord's disciples ask 3 questions; a) "when shall these things be," b) "what shall be the sign of thy coming," c) "and of the end of the world?"....We can therefore assume by the questions, that the Lord's answers will be appropriate to the questions. Jesus then begins to answer their questions FULLY.
Verse 4...."4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you."....Is Jesus speaking to "Tribulation Saints" in this clear directive? No! He is speaking to the Church of all ages through his vessels - The Disciples.
Verse 5..."5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many."... Many shall come in my name saying "I am Christ" and shall deceive many. ... Question:... How can this possibly be speaking of those "Left Behind" when the Lord says "Many will come in MY NAME and deceive many saying I AM CHRIST! Could he possibly be speaking to non-believing Jews? Those who openly REJECT the name of Jesus? - of course not. He is speaking to the Church of the ages regarding the signs of his coming!
Verse 6..."6And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet."...And Ye (same ye - the Church) shall hear of wars and rumors of wars, these things MUST come to pass but THE END IS NOT YET!
Verse 7..."7For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places."...War, Famine, Pestilence, Earthquakes!
Verse 8..."8All these are the beginning of sorrows. "... This is only the BEGINNING OF SORROWS.
Verse 9..."9Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake."... They shall deliver YOU up to affliction. Who can Jesus possibly be speaking of here? Certainly not unbelieving Jews of the “70th week of Daniel”. He can only be speaking of the Church at large in those days. He clearly states "You will be hated of ALL NATIONS FOR MY NAME'S SAKE. Jesus can be speaking to none other than the CHURCH, the redeemed, the elect!
Verse 10..."10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. "... Betrayal!
Verse 11..."11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. "
... False Prophets!
Verse 12..."12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. "... Iniquity shall abound! (see 2nd Thessalonians, Chapter 2)
Verse 13..."13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. "
... He that shall endure TO THE END shall be saved. The Lord continues to speak of THE ELECT, the Church!
... I Corinthians 15:22-24 "22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power."
... II Corinthians 1:13-14 "13For we write none other things unto you, than what ye read or acknowledge; and I trust ye shall acknowledge even to the end; 14As also ye have acknowledged us in part, that we are your rejoicing, even as ye also are ours in the day of the Lord Jesus."
... Hebrews 6:11 "11And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:"
... I Peter 1:13 "13Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;"
... Revelation 2:25-26 "25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come. 26And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:"
Verses 14-21
Verse 14..."14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations;and then shall the end come."... And this gospel of the Kingdom SHALL BE PREACHED in all the world… Question: If these events take place AFTER the rapture, then who may I ask will be spreading the gospel to ALL THE NATIONS? Those "LEFT BEHIND?" An absurd notion!
Verse 15..."15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) ".Now he speaks to JEW and GENTILE in reference to “reading” the BOOK OF DANIEL.
Verse 16..."16Then let them which be in Judaea [JEWS] flee into the mountains: "Verse 17..."17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: "... HIM
Verse 18..."18Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. "... HIM
Verse 19..."19And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! "
Verse 20 ..."20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: "
The reason that FLIGHT would be difficult on SABBATH is because of the SABBATH REST laws which would make it very difficult for many Jews..
Verse 21..."21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. "
... Note: Daniel 12:1-3 1And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever."...Note: "everyone that shall be found written in the book, and many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake." There is clearly a resurrection of the righteous dead after this event of the Great Tribulation. This resurrection coincides with the resurrection of the righteous dead mentioned in Revelation 20. THIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTION, and it comes after the tribulation of Matthew 24.
Verses 22-28Verse 22..."22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. "
... Those days SHALL be shortened for the sake of the elect! It is frequently said in pre-tribulation theology that the ELECT mentioned here are "Tribulation Saints," those 'LEFT BEHIND.'
Let's take a Biblical look at the ELECT
..The English word "elect" is taken from the Greek word "eklectos." In every verse or passage in the New Testament, the term "elect" is used to describe the Church - the Church of all ages. It is never attempted by New Testament writers to individualize the "elect" i.e. pre-tribulation elect versus tribulation "elect." The elect ARE the elect - the Church!
Elect - EKLEKTOS: "The Chosen"
II Timothy 2:10:..."Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory."
Romans 8:33: ..."Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth."
Collossians 3:12:..."Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;"
Titus 1:1:..."Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;"
I Peter 1:2:..."Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied."
Matthew 24:22:..."And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
Matthew 24:24:..."For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
WE ARE SUPPOSE TO BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS REFERING TO “TRIBULATION JEWS IN THE OLIVETTE, WHEN THE ENTIRE NEW TESTAMENT DECLARES THAT IT IS THE CHURCH , THAT IS “GOD’S ELECT” ??
Note: Mark 13:20 ..."For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect."
EKLECTOS - WHOM HE HATH CHOSEN
Verse 23..."23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. "... Another admonition of false Christs. Who would be interested in knowing the identity of FALSE CHRISTS? The Jews?-------NONSENSE----- Only the elect, THE CHURCH!
Verse 24..."24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. "
... Note: "if it were possible, they would deceive the very ELECT."
Verse 25-26..."25Behold, I have told you before. "26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. "
... Another caution TO THE ELECT - THE CHURCH.
Verse 27..."27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. "
... The ONLY way the Son of Man will come FOR HIS ELECT!
Verse 28..."28For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. "
... Where you see one event, you can expect another! Now Jesus will tell us exactly when the church will be taken.
Verses 29-31
Verse 29..."29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: "
Immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun and moon will be darkened and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.
Mark 13:24: ..."24But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, "
Joel 2:31-32..."31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. " "32And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call. "
Isaiah 13:6-13:..."6Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty. 7Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt: 8And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames. 9Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. 10For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine. 11And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible. 12I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir. 13Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger. "
Revelation 6:12-13:..."12And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. "
THIS IS THE ONLY "DAY OF THE LORD" DESCRIBED IN ALL OF THE BIBLE!
Verse 30..."30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. "...Note: "And then shall appear."
Verse 31..."31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. "
THE RAPTURE!
THE ONLY RAPTURE! THE ONLY RAPTURE!
Mark 13:27:..."27And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. "
Matthew 13:39:..."39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels." "
Matthew 13:47-49:..."47Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: 48Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. 49So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, "
I Corinthians 15:51-52:..."51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. "
We shall be CHANGED , then gathered by the ANGELS!
Verse 32-34..."32Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. "... So much for imminence!
Verse 35..."35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."...The certainty of these events.
Verse 36..."36But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."...This day and hour is speaking of the entirety of the events of this Discourse.
Verse 37-39..."37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."... Reference: Noah
Verse 40-41..."40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. "...It is interesting to note that some that teach pre-tribulationism utilize these verses (40-41) as representations of the Rapture. They conveniently remove these verses from their context i.e. AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS. This is a clear and flagrant perversion of this text. It is shameful to say in the least!
Verse 42..."42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. "
...Jesus can ONLY be speaking of the entirety of this Discourse when He says "you know not what hour YOUR LORD doth come." Note: "YOUR LORD." Can Jesus be speaking to anyone other than The Church?
Verse 43-44..."43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh."
...Be ye ALSO Ready, like the Goodman of the house. How can we be ready if the rapture takes place without any preceding signs? Jesus warns us in these verses to "know the watch" through the events of the Olivet Discourse.
I Thessalonians 5:4-6: "4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober."
...I must mention that Pre-tribulationists frequently use these two verses to support the notion that Jesus will rapture His Church before the” 70th week of Daniel”, using the words "in such an hour, as ye think not - the Son of Man cometh." Isn't it interesting that in all of the Olivet Discourse, it is said that the YE's of the passage are "tribulation saints" or "tribulation Jews", then they try to use the "YE" of verse 44 of the same Discourse to say that this speaks of a pre-tribulation rapture. AMAZING!
Verse 45-51..."45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? 46Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 47Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. 48But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49And shall begin to smite hisfellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. "...Verses 45-51 identify and separate the good servants of the Church Age from the bad servants. Note, in verse 45 the words "in due season." This speaks of the rewards that follow the works of the wise servant, which will come at the end of the age when Christ will return in the air and gathers together His elect....The evil servant will not be watching for the signs of His coming. He will suffer the wrath of God and be punished with the ungodly at the end of the age. Remember that THE DAY OF THE LORD begins AFTER the tribulation of those days.
Will the gathering together of God's elect take place prior to the opening of SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION?
Impossibl
Matthew 24 Olivet Discourse
Matthew 24Olivet Discourse
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. 2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? 4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. 6And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. 8All these are the beginning of sorrows. 9Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. 10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. 11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. 23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25Behold, I have told you before. 26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. 32Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. 35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. 36But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. 37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. 45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? 46Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 47Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. 48But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
It is said of those who teach the Pre-Tribulation Rapture, that the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24 and Mark 13) has little to do with the church today. The claim of pre-tribulation proponents is that the events of the Olivet discourse happen (for the most part) during the “seventieth week of Daniel”.
It is also taught that the entirety of the 70th week of Daniel is explicitly "synonymous" with the Day of the Lord. Since the Lord has promised to deliver the church from the Day of the Lord, then "CERTAINLY" the church must be raptured prior to the events of the Olivet Discourse.
Their explanation of the events in this discourse is thus: "The Olivet Discourse relates specifically to Tribulation Saints, Tribulation Jews and others who have been LEFT BEHIND following the rapture. There is a popular fictional novel in series as well as a movie (Left behind), which deals with many aspects of this doctrine. This is the prevailing position on the Olivet Discourse in evangelical Christianity in the western church today.
Let's see what the Bible says about this position.
The Rebuttal
"; document.write(lubid_string); //-->
Tell us, when shall these things be? what shall be the sign of thy coming and of the end of the world?............
....It is said in pre-tribulationism that Matthew 24 and Mark 13 (the Olivet Discourse) have "little if anything" to do with the church and the church age. It is proudly proclaimed that the church will be raptured from the earth prior to the events of the Olivet Discourse and that the only Christians That will see those events are those unsaved people who were "LEFT BEHIND" at the advent of the rapture. Let's take a close look at the Olivet Discourse and see if these claims are so.
Verse 3...."3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?".... Please note in verse 3, the Lord's disciples ask 3 questions; a) "when shall these things be," b) "what shall be the sign of thy coming," c) "and of the end of the world?"....We can therefore assume by the questions, that the Lord's answers will be appropriate to the questions. Jesus then begins to answer their questions FULLY.
Verse 4...."4And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you."....Is Jesus speaking to "Tribulation Saints" in this clear directive? No! He is speaking to the Church of all ages through his vessels - The Disciples.
Verse 5..."5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many."... Many shall come in my name saying "I am Christ" and shall deceive many. ... Question:... How can this possibly be speaking of those "Left Behind" when the Lord says "Many will come in MY NAME and deceive many saying I AM CHRIST! Could he possibly be speaking to non-believing Jews? Those who openly REJECT the name of Jesus? - of course not. He is speaking to the Church of the ages regarding the signs of his coming!
Verse 6..."6And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet."...And Ye (same ye - the Church) shall hear of wars and rumors of wars, these things MUST come to pass but THE END IS NOT YET!
Verse 7..."7For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places."...War, Famine, Pestilence, Earthquakes!
Verse 8..."8All these are the beginning of sorrows. "... This is only the BEGINNING OF SORROWS.
Verse 9..."9Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake."... They shall deliver YOU up to affliction. Who can Jesus possibly be speaking of here? Certainly not unbelieving Jews of the “70th week of Daniel”. He can only be speaking of the Church at large in those days. He clearly states "You will be hated of ALL NATIONS FOR MY NAME'S SAKE. Jesus can be speaking to none other than the CHURCH, the redeemed, the elect!
Verse 10..."10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. "... Betrayal!
Verse 11..."11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. "
... False Prophets!
Verse 12..."12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. "... Iniquity shall abound! (see 2nd Thessalonians, Chapter 2)
Verse 13..."13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. "
... He that shall endure TO THE END shall be saved. The Lord continues to speak of THE ELECT, the Church!
... I Corinthians 15:22-24 "22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power."
... II Corinthians 1:13-14 "13For we write none other things unto you, than what ye read or acknowledge; and I trust ye shall acknowledge even to the end; 14As also ye have acknowledged us in part, that we are your rejoicing, even as ye also are ours in the day of the Lord Jesus."
... Hebrews 6:11 "11And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:"
... I Peter 1:13 "13Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;"
... Revelation 2:25-26 "25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come. 26And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:"
Verses 14-21
Verse 14..."14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations;and then shall the end come."... And this gospel of the Kingdom SHALL BE PREACHED in all the world… Question: If these events take place AFTER the rapture, then who may I ask will be spreading the gospel to ALL THE NATIONS? Those "LEFT BEHIND?" An absurd notion!
Verse 15..."15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) ".Now he speaks to JEW and GENTILE in reference to “reading” the BOOK OF DANIEL.
Verse 16..."16Then let them which be in Judaea [JEWS] flee into the mountains: "Verse 17..."17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: "... HIM
Verse 18..."18Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. "... HIM
Verse 19..."19And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! "
Verse 20 ..."20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: "
The reason that FLIGHT would be difficult on SABBATH is because of the SABBATH REST laws which would make it very difficult for many Jews..
Verse 21..."21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. "
... Note: Daniel 12:1-3 1And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever."...Note: "everyone that shall be found written in the book, and many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake." There is clearly a resurrection of the righteous dead after this event of the Great Tribulation. This resurrection coincides with the resurrection of the righteous dead mentioned in Revelation 20. THIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTION, and it comes after the tribulation of Matthew 24.
Verses 22-28Verse 22..."22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. "
... Those days SHALL be shortened for the sake of the elect! It is frequently said in pre-tribulation theology that the ELECT mentioned here are "Tribulation Saints," those 'LEFT BEHIND.'
Let's take a Biblical look at the ELECT
..The English word "elect" is taken from the Greek word "eklectos." In every verse or passage in the New Testament, the term "elect" is used to describe the Church - the Church of all ages. It is never attempted by New Testament writers to individualize the "elect" i.e. pre-tribulation elect versus tribulation "elect." The elect ARE the elect - the Church!
Elect - EKLEKTOS: "The Chosen"
II Timothy 2:10:..."Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory."
Romans 8:33: ..."Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth."
Collossians 3:12:..."Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;"
Titus 1:1:..."Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;"
I Peter 1:2:..."Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied."
Matthew 24:22:..."And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
Matthew 24:24:..."For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
WE ARE SUPPOSE TO BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS REFERING TO “TRIBULATION JEWS IN THE OLIVETTE, WHEN THE ENTIRE NEW TESTAMENT DECLARES THAT IT IS THE CHURCH , THAT IS “GOD’S ELECT” ??
Note: Mark 13:20 ..."For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect."
EKLECTOS - WHOM HE HATH CHOSEN
Verse 23..."23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. "... Another admonition of false Christs. Who would be interested in knowing the identity of FALSE CHRISTS? The Jews?-------NONSENSE----- Only the elect, THE CHURCH!
Verse 24..."24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. "
... Note: "if it were possible, they would deceive the very ELECT."
Verse 25-26..."25Behold, I have told you before. "26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. "
... Another caution TO THE ELECT - THE CHURCH.
Verse 27..."27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. "
... The ONLY way the Son of Man will come FOR HIS ELECT!
Verse 28..."28For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. "
... Where you see one event, you can expect another! Now Jesus will tell us exactly when the church will be taken.
Verses 29-31
Verse 29..."29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: "
Immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun and moon will be darkened and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.
Mark 13:24: ..."24But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, "
Joel 2:31-32..."31The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. " "32And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call. "
Isaiah 13:6-13:..."6Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty. 7Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt: 8And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames. 9Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. 10For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine. 11And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible. 12I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir. 13Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger. "
Revelation 6:12-13:..."12And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. "
THIS IS THE ONLY "DAY OF THE LORD" DESCRIBED IN ALL OF THE BIBLE!
Verse 30..."30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. "...Note: "And then shall appear."
Verse 31..."31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. "
THE RAPTURE!
THE ONLY RAPTURE! THE ONLY RAPTURE!
Mark 13:27:..."27And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. "
Matthew 13:39:..."39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels." "
Matthew 13:47-49:..."47Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: 48Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. 49So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, "
I Corinthians 15:51-52:..."51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. "
We shall be CHANGED , then gathered by the ANGELS!
Verse 32-34..."32Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: 33So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. 34Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. "... So much for imminence!
Verse 35..."35Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."...The certainty of these events.
Verse 36..."36But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."...This day and hour is speaking of the entirety of the events of this Discourse.
Verse 37-39..."37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."... Reference: Noah
Verse 40-41..."40Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 41Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. "...It is interesting to note that some that teach pre-tribulationism utilize these verses (40-41) as representations of the Rapture. They conveniently remove these verses from their context i.e. AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS. This is a clear and flagrant perversion of this text. It is shameful to say in the least!
Verse 42..."42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. "
...Jesus can ONLY be speaking of the entirety of this Discourse when He says "you know not what hour YOUR LORD doth come." Note: "YOUR LORD." Can Jesus be speaking to anyone other than The Church?
Verse 43-44..."43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh."
...Be ye ALSO Ready, like the Goodman of the house. How can we be ready if the rapture takes place without any preceding signs? Jesus warns us in these verses to "know the watch" through the events of the Olivet Discourse.
I Thessalonians 5:4-6: "4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober."
...I must mention that Pre-tribulationists frequently use these two verses to support the notion that Jesus will rapture His Church before the” 70th week of Daniel”, using the words "in such an hour, as ye think not - the Son of Man cometh." Isn't it interesting that in all of the Olivet Discourse, it is said that the YE's of the passage are "tribulation saints" or "tribulation Jews", then they try to use the "YE" of verse 44 of the same Discourse to say that this speaks of a pre-tribulation rapture. AMAZING!
Verse 45-51..."45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? 46Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 47Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. 48But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; 49And shall begin to smite hisfellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; 50The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, 51And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. "...Verses 45-51 identify and separate the good servants of the Church Age from the bad servants. Note, in verse 45 the words "in due season." This speaks of the rewards that follow the works of the wise servant, which will come at the end of the age when Christ will return in the air and gathers together His elect....The evil servant will not be watching for the signs of His coming. He will suffer the wrath of God and be punished with the ungodly at the end of the age. Remember that THE DAY OF THE LORD begins AFTER the tribulation of those days.
Will the gathering together of God's elect take place prior to the opening of SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION?
Impossibl
Coming as a THEIF---apologetics
Oct 24, 2007
Coming As A Thief
The Pre-tribulation Thief
Danny McDowell
Pre-tribulationists frequently cite scriptures concerning Christ’s “return as a thief in the night” to support their doctrine of “imminence.” The reasoning behind the use of the “Thief” passages is to establish and promote the notion that “Christ’s” coming as a thief, in an hour and day that no man knows” supports their position of Imminence. Pre-tribulationists teach that the Gathering of the Church (Rapture) has been imminent since the establishment of the church at Pentecost. Here are the verses commonly used in this position.
Matthew 24:42-44
“42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
MARK 13:32-33 "32 but of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the SON , but the FATHER, 33 take ye heed ,watch and pray; fo ye know not when the time is"
Luke 12:40
“40Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.”
I Thessalonians 5:2
“2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”
Revelation 3:3
“3Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.”
Revelation 16:15
" Behold I come as a thief, Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame."
These are, in fact, the totality of verses used in support of imminence regarding the gathering of the elect (the Church). Is this the intent of those particular passages?
Let’s see what the Bible
REALLY SAYS. Read On Below
The Thief
Matthew 24:44
“44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
The strong admonition of the Lord in this verse is to KNOW THE WATCH! Jesus clearly uses the example of “The Goodman of the House” who “if he KNEW in what hour the thief would come, he would NOT allow his house to be entered. What possible intent could Jesus possibly have in using this parable? Is it to say that we SHOULD NOT or COULD NOT know the WATCH? This is an absurd notion indeed. Can you imagine? Pre-tribulationists would have us believe that “being ignorant of THE WATCH is a good thing. Let’s follow up with verse 44.
Matthew 24:44
“44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
“Be ye also ready…” Let me say this more clearly,
BE YE ALSO READY
Can it be truthfully proclaimed by any stretch of the imagination that Jesus is suggesting that there will be NO signs prior to his coming for the church. We must remember the context of this entire passage is in regard to “The Last Days.”
Pre-tribulationists would have us believe that Jesus suddenly, and without warning, departs from his discourse and crashes into another direction, i.e. “Imminence.” This is an assault on common sense! The ONLY person who will be caught “off guard” in this passage is found in verses 48-51.
He is that “EVIL SERVANT!” The “DAY” in this passage refers to the “time frame” of the passage, and the “HOUR” refers to the actual advent of the gathering of the “ELECT,” verse 31. (“31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”)
Luke 12:39
“39And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through.”
The same reasoning is applied to this verse. Pre-tribulationists simply disregard context to make their point. Let’s read the entire context.
Luke 12:35-46
“35Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning; 36And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately. 37Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them. 38And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants. 39And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not. 41Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.”
Note in verse 38 that the Lord again refers to “THE WATCH.” This is a military term and it is NEVER applied to a “momentary” point in time. It is always speaking of “FRAMES of TIME.” Anyone who has served in the armed forces can easily understand the meaning of “THE WATCH.” The “WATCH” begins at a predetermined point in time, and ends in the same way.
When Jesus uses the terms “2nd watch, 3rd watch” he is referring to “time frames” with the church age. Once again Jesus points to the “Goodman of the House” as the example for “KNOWING the WATCH.” It is simply amazing to me that “WATHCING” has been interpreted as “Being caught by surprise” by the pre-tribulationists. The S-T-R-E-T-C-H of this interpretation simply boggles the mind.
Note verse 41-43: “41Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.”
It is said in pre-tribulationism that the Olivet Discourse is pertinent to only those “left behind” and the “Jews.” Look closely at verse 41. Peter asks the question, “Are you speaking to us ONLY, or to ALL?” Jesus’ reply answers the question unequivocally – This is meant for the Church of ALL AGES!
Pre-tribulationists emphatically claim that the Olivet Discourse of Matthew 24 and Mark 13 does not apply to the Church of all ages since the Church will be “raptured” prior to those events, yet Jesus uses this SAME parable (the Goodman of the house) in this passage and clears up the question, “who does he speak to here.” The answer is unquestionably ALL!I Thessalonians 5:2
“2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”
Interesting that only the first verse of this thought is used to support imminence in this passage. Let’s take some time to develop the teaching that Paul is expounding to the Thessalonians. This is the entire context of this thought.
I Thessalonians 5:1-11
“1But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. 2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. 7For they that sleep, sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.”
Verse 1: the Thessalonians have already been informed of the times and seasons by Paul’s prior personal teaching to this church.
Verse 3: speaks of “THEY” – the unbeliever. When “they” say “Peace and Safety” is this a sign? Of course it is, and yet the pre-tribulationists declare “there are no preceding signs.”
Verse 4: “4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.” Emphatically YOU WILL NOT BE CAUGHT OFF GUARD!
WHY?
“4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”
Verse “You ARE THE CHILDREN of LIGHT” the light of Paul’s teaching about “THE DAY OF THE LORD.”
Verse 6: “. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.”
LET US WATCH!
Verse 9: “9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,” This verse is frequently used to support a pre-tribulation rapture since the apostle guarantees the church exemption from God’s wrath, which they, in error, interpret as the entire 70th week of Daniel.
Coming As A Thief
The Pre-tribulation Thief
Danny McDowell
Pre-tribulationists frequently cite scriptures concerning Christ’s “return as a thief in the night” to support their doctrine of “imminence.” The reasoning behind the use of the “Thief” passages is to establish and promote the notion that “Christ’s” coming as a thief, in an hour and day that no man knows” supports their position of Imminence. Pre-tribulationists teach that the Gathering of the Church (Rapture) has been imminent since the establishment of the church at Pentecost. Here are the verses commonly used in this position.
Matthew 24:42-44
“42Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. 43But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. 44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
MARK 13:32-33 "32 but of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the SON , but the FATHER, 33 take ye heed ,watch and pray; fo ye know not when the time is"
Luke 12:40
“40Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.”
I Thessalonians 5:2
“2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”
Revelation 3:3
“3Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.”
Revelation 16:15
" Behold I come as a thief, Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame."
These are, in fact, the totality of verses used in support of imminence regarding the gathering of the elect (the Church). Is this the intent of those particular passages?
Let’s see what the Bible
REALLY SAYS. Read On Below
The Thief
Matthew 24:44
“44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
The strong admonition of the Lord in this verse is to KNOW THE WATCH! Jesus clearly uses the example of “The Goodman of the House” who “if he KNEW in what hour the thief would come, he would NOT allow his house to be entered. What possible intent could Jesus possibly have in using this parable? Is it to say that we SHOULD NOT or COULD NOT know the WATCH? This is an absurd notion indeed. Can you imagine? Pre-tribulationists would have us believe that “being ignorant of THE WATCH is a good thing. Let’s follow up with verse 44.
Matthew 24:44
“44Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.”
“Be ye also ready…” Let me say this more clearly,
BE YE ALSO READY
Can it be truthfully proclaimed by any stretch of the imagination that Jesus is suggesting that there will be NO signs prior to his coming for the church. We must remember the context of this entire passage is in regard to “The Last Days.”
Pre-tribulationists would have us believe that Jesus suddenly, and without warning, departs from his discourse and crashes into another direction, i.e. “Imminence.” This is an assault on common sense! The ONLY person who will be caught “off guard” in this passage is found in verses 48-51.
He is that “EVIL SERVANT!” The “DAY” in this passage refers to the “time frame” of the passage, and the “HOUR” refers to the actual advent of the gathering of the “ELECT,” verse 31. (“31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”)
Luke 12:39
“39And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through.”
The same reasoning is applied to this verse. Pre-tribulationists simply disregard context to make their point. Let’s read the entire context.
Luke 12:35-46
“35Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning; 36And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately. 37Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them. 38And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants. 39And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not. 41Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.”
Note in verse 38 that the Lord again refers to “THE WATCH.” This is a military term and it is NEVER applied to a “momentary” point in time. It is always speaking of “FRAMES of TIME.” Anyone who has served in the armed forces can easily understand the meaning of “THE WATCH.” The “WATCH” begins at a predetermined point in time, and ends in the same way.
When Jesus uses the terms “2nd watch, 3rd watch” he is referring to “time frames” with the church age. Once again Jesus points to the “Goodman of the House” as the example for “KNOWING the WATCH.” It is simply amazing to me that “WATHCING” has been interpreted as “Being caught by surprise” by the pre-tribulationists. The S-T-R-E-T-C-H of this interpretation simply boggles the mind.
Note verse 41-43: “41Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.”
It is said in pre-tribulationism that the Olivet Discourse is pertinent to only those “left behind” and the “Jews.” Look closely at verse 41. Peter asks the question, “Are you speaking to us ONLY, or to ALL?” Jesus’ reply answers the question unequivocally – This is meant for the Church of ALL AGES!
Pre-tribulationists emphatically claim that the Olivet Discourse of Matthew 24 and Mark 13 does not apply to the Church of all ages since the Church will be “raptured” prior to those events, yet Jesus uses this SAME parable (the Goodman of the house) in this passage and clears up the question, “who does he speak to here.” The answer is unquestionably ALL!I Thessalonians 5:2
“2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.”
Interesting that only the first verse of this thought is used to support imminence in this passage. Let’s take some time to develop the teaching that Paul is expounding to the Thessalonians. This is the entire context of this thought.
I Thessalonians 5:1-11
“1But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. 2For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. 7For they that sleep, sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.”
Verse 1: the Thessalonians have already been informed of the times and seasons by Paul’s prior personal teaching to this church.
Verse 3: speaks of “THEY” – the unbeliever. When “they” say “Peace and Safety” is this a sign? Of course it is, and yet the pre-tribulationists declare “there are no preceding signs.”
Verse 4: “4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.” Emphatically YOU WILL NOT BE CAUGHT OFF GUARD!
WHY?
“4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”
Verse “You ARE THE CHILDREN of LIGHT” the light of Paul’s teaching about “THE DAY OF THE LORD.”
Verse 6: “. 6Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.”
LET US WATCH!
Verse 9: “9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,” This verse is frequently used to support a pre-tribulation rapture since the apostle guarantees the church exemption from God’s wrath, which they, in error, interpret as the entire 70th week of Daniel.
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)